The media loves to talk about who wins because it gives them the opportunity to run their mouths (or keyboards), but the real judges are the American voters and who have some time to decide. And if a Trump or Clinton supporter thinks the opposing candidate won, that won’t change their vote.
The bottom-line: candidates either gain votes, lose them, or stay the same based after a debate.
JimCsays
I’m not sure that was exactly PP’s point; I think he meant it more globally.
Christophersays
I fully expect an email tonight or tomorrow from the Clinton campaign explaining that she hit it out of the park tonight. I’m sure the DUMB candidate will do likewise.
johnksays
but at this point, how the heck haven’t you decided? What’s going to actually happen that would make you change your mind? Or help you decide?
Christophersays
Believe it or not there may be millions of people hearing either of the candidates’ greatest hits for the first time.
jconwaysays
The Kerry/Bush debate is on C-SPAN right now and it’s actually a lot more substantive than anything we have watched or will likely watch in 2016. Kerry is looking a lot more assertive than I remembered, and Bush is coming across a lot more knowledgeable about foreign affairs. They disagreed civilly without personal attacks and actually discussed the issues. It’s truly appalling how far we have fallen.
I wasn’t old enough to vote in that election but would likely have voted third party, I was so appalled by Kerry’s lackluster performance. In retrospect, I think he would’ve been a fine President. It’s also sad that President Bush repeatedly praised Islam as a religion of peace, cited positive examples of immigrants in the US, and said he was proud to reauthorize the Voting Rights Act. He also vowed (incorrectly) that we did not and would not torture. But at least his heart was in the right place on that issue. How far we have fallen from what was considered one of our worst and least inspiring elections, and now we have a truly incapable and inexperienced person unable to perform the basic task of being President.
Christophersays
I’ve seen no indication that Holt will be anything other than professional.
jconwaysays
Holt asked tough questions of Jeb and other candidates he interviewed during the primary campaign, and is a hard working guy full of integrity. A Chicago institution as well, my wife’s been a fan since he was on WBBM.
Chris Wallace is a registered Democrat, and will likely be the most center-right leaning moderator. He’s been particularly harsh on Bill Clinton in the past, but I give him credit for being fair to Bernie and Hillary in the primary and tough by comparison on Trump. A lot of these folks don’t vote, Jim Leher and Bob Schieffer said they never did.
johntmaysays
that we would return to the League of Women Voters style, but too many of us have accepted the “globalization” bullshit argument that allows this sort of thing without push back.
jconwaysays
I don’t think anyone here likes the CPD format and most of us favor LMV. But it is what it is, there are a lot of structural changes that have to happen to our government before third parties can be viable. Trust me, I know this well đŸ˜‰
It’ll likely happen at the state and congressional levels first, and it will be interesting to see what certain parties do with their status and it’s likely the Libertarians and Greens can keep theirs in MA.
Christophersays
…does debate format have to do with globalization?
sabutaisays
Extended discussion about email and the Clinton Foundation. No questions about Trump’s business practices. Not a single question about education or health care.
Christophersays
I only recall one brief exchange about email and no references at all to the Clinton Foundation.
jconwaysays
Hillary mentions profit sharing in her first comment, something I’ve often harped on here. Also Trump mentions Carrier moving to Mexico, an example I’ve often discussed here.
Mark L. Bailsays
and Donald looks crazy. She’s already knocked him off Trump 2.0.
Mark L. Bailsays
doing much moderating.
jconwaysays
I’m listening on the radio and it seems even
jconwaysays
Which is a major disappointment.
Christophersays
Pushed back and fact checked a bit when necessary, but mostly stayed out of the way.
JimCsays
He clearly decided to stay out of the way, but he interjected when necessary.
Mark L. Bailsays
When I realized no one else was, I stopped.
Holt did alright.
jconwaysays
Trump name dropping Carrier and putting her on the ropes for NAFTA were good moments for him, but she’s getting more comfortable asserting herself and putting him on the ropes. Her email answer was good.
I liked her barbs on having a plan to fight ISIS and that Donald lives in his own reality. Not sure if his name dropping his wealth helps him, and her digs at Fred Trump and pivot to her humble origins were good. I’m also
Listening on the radio and his body language could be really awful.
thegreenmiles says
https://twitter.com/MilesGrant/status/780444973913235456
doubleman says
#NailedIt
Peter Porcupine says
Nobody wins.
Mark L. Bail says
Debates aren’t won and lost.
The media loves to talk about who wins because it gives them the opportunity to run their mouths (or keyboards), but the real judges are the American voters and who have some time to decide. And if a Trump or Clinton supporter thinks the opposing candidate won, that won’t change their vote.
The bottom-line: candidates either gain votes, lose them, or stay the same based after a debate.
JimC says
I’m not sure that was exactly PP’s point; I think he meant it more globally.
Christopher says
I fully expect an email tonight or tomorrow from the Clinton campaign explaining that she hit it out of the park tonight. I’m sure the DUMB candidate will do likewise.
johnk says
but at this point, how the heck haven’t you decided? What’s going to actually happen that would make you change your mind? Or help you decide?
Christopher says
Believe it or not there may be millions of people hearing either of the candidates’ greatest hits for the first time.
jconway says
The Kerry/Bush debate is on C-SPAN right now and it’s actually a lot more substantive than anything we have watched or will likely watch in 2016. Kerry is looking a lot more assertive than I remembered, and Bush is coming across a lot more knowledgeable about foreign affairs. They disagreed civilly without personal attacks and actually discussed the issues. It’s truly appalling how far we have fallen.
I wasn’t old enough to vote in that election but would likely have voted third party, I was so appalled by Kerry’s lackluster performance. In retrospect, I think he would’ve been a fine President. It’s also sad that President Bush repeatedly praised Islam as a religion of peace, cited positive examples of immigrants in the US, and said he was proud to reauthorize the Voting Rights Act. He also vowed (incorrectly) that we did not and would not torture. But at least his heart was in the right place on that issue. How far we have fallen from what was considered one of our worst and least inspiring elections, and now we have a truly incapable and inexperienced person unable to perform the basic task of being President.
Christopher says
I’ve seen no indication that Holt will be anything other than professional.
jconway says
Holt asked tough questions of Jeb and other candidates he interviewed during the primary campaign, and is a hard working guy full of integrity. A Chicago institution as well, my wife’s been a fan since he was on WBBM.
Chris Wallace is a registered Democrat, and will likely be the most center-right leaning moderator. He’s been particularly harsh on Bill Clinton in the past, but I give him credit for being fair to Bernie and Hillary in the primary and tough by comparison on Trump. A lot of these folks don’t vote, Jim Leher and Bob Schieffer said they never did.
johntmay says
that we would return to the League of Women Voters style, but too many of us have accepted the “globalization” bullshit argument that allows this sort of thing without push back.
jconway says
I don’t think anyone here likes the CPD format and most of us favor LMV. But it is what it is, there are a lot of structural changes that have to happen to our government before third parties can be viable. Trust me, I know this well đŸ˜‰
It’ll likely happen at the state and congressional levels first, and it will be interesting to see what certain parties do with their status and it’s likely the Libertarians and Greens can keep theirs in MA.
Christopher says
…does debate format have to do with globalization?
sabutai says
Extended discussion about email and the Clinton Foundation. No questions about Trump’s business practices. Not a single question about education or health care.
Christopher says
I only recall one brief exchange about email and no references at all to the Clinton Foundation.
jconway says
Hillary mentions profit sharing in her first comment, something I’ve often harped on here. Also Trump mentions Carrier moving to Mexico, an example I’ve often discussed here.
Mark L. Bail says
and Donald looks crazy. She’s already knocked him off Trump 2.0.
Mark L. Bail says
doing much moderating.
jconway says
I’m listening on the radio and it seems even
jconway says
Which is a major disappointment.
Christopher says
Pushed back and fact checked a bit when necessary, but mostly stayed out of the way.
JimC says
He clearly decided to stay out of the way, but he interjected when necessary.
Mark L. Bail says
When I realized no one else was, I stopped.
Holt did alright.
jconway says
Trump name dropping Carrier and putting her on the ropes for NAFTA were good moments for him, but she’s getting more comfortable asserting herself and putting him on the ropes. Her email answer was good.
I liked her barbs on having a plan to fight ISIS and that Donald lives in his own reality. Not sure if his name dropping his wealth helps him, and her digs at Fred Trump and pivot to her humble origins were good. I’m also
Listening on the radio and his body language could be really awful.