A June 28 editorial in the Wall Street Journal critiques the recent presidential debate this way : ‘Democrats march in lockstep with the Left. What are they offering voters who backed Trump in 2016?’
David Corn, Mother Jones DC Bureau chief, answers : “A candidate who is not a narcissistic, lying, demagogic, authoritarian, bigoted, misogynistic sociopath who has boasted of committing sexual assault and been credibly accused of rape — and who aided and abetted a foreign adversary’s attack on the United States. That’s all.”
Please share widely!
SomervilleTom says
My immediate response is to offer them a free one-way ticket to Moscow, Beijing, or Pyongyang. I care less about the voters who supported Mr. Trump in 2016 than I do about the voters who profess support for him now.
I think we invite them to come to their senses and rejoin civilized society. I think we drown out those who decline the offer with new voters who join us in being absolutely appalled by virtually aspect of Donald Trump, his family, and the GOP Collaborators who support him.
doubleman says
There have been many things recently from Republicans saying that Democrats need to appeal to Republicans. Bret Stephens has one this weekend about the Democrats needing to appeal to Republican voters. Last week Meghan McCain on The View pressed Julian Castro on his immigration policy and said that in a general he would have to “win over people like me.”
It’s all crap and I hope Democrats don’t fall into the trap of thinking we need a candidate who can win over Trump supporters.
The simple fact is that to win the Presidency, a Democrat needs to win exactly ZERO Trump voters. Trying to appeal to them with conservative policies is a surefire way to lose this election.
SomervilleTom says
I totally agree.
Donald Trump is the predictable and logical result of almost forty years of GOP lies, beginning with the GOP embrace of Ronald Reagan and everything he stood for. Forty years — that’s a nice Biblical number on this Sunday.
I think that Democrats have been trying to appeal to Democrats ever since then, with Barack Obama being the most extreme case. Mr. Obama spent the first six years of his administration trying to win over Republican hearts and minds.
Mitch McConnell led the savage, bigoted, and utterly destructive GOP response. Mr. Stephens and Ms. McCain would do well to focus their attention on their own party — starting with the radical suggestion that they embrace rather than deny facts, science, and logic.
Any attempt by Democrats to “win over” people like Ms. Stephens and Ms. McCain only obscures the important lesson each of them and every Republican needs to take away from this shameful administration.
Democrats did not put Mitch McConnell in the Senate. Democrats did not put Donald Trump in the White House.
Democrats did not kill Valeria Ramirez and her father.
jconway says
The number one thing 2016 should have taught us is that the constituency for a fiscally conservative/socially liberal candidate is less than 5% of the electorate. Swing voters are NOT that.
Over 70% of the entire voting population is left of center on every major economic issue.
This is why the arguments Biden and the similarly disposed also rans are making make zero sense. Centrism on the economy is what doomed the last Democratic nominee and made the last Democratic president lose his 2010 majority.
People are angry and want to see big business punished. They want to see CEOs go to jail instead of getting bailouts, tax cuts, and windfalls. People love Trump calling out GM and threatening the CEO. Warren can do that too while actually delivering on the change these voters want. She can do so while fighting the racism and misogyny that is also driving some of these voters into the arms of the GOP.
An ally for working people of all races and gender identities. That is who we need to nominate. Not the credit card company’s best friend in the Senate.
fredrichlariccia says
Divide and conquer. Our fascist enemies will try to turn us against each other. We must not let that happen. As a progressive family we can and will disagree on policy at how best to reach our goal of defeating Trumpism through peace, prosperity and progress for all. But do not play into their attempt to destroy us through personal attack.
fredrichlariccia says
I’m not counting Joe Biden out of the running just yet after watching him give a very impressive one on one interview with CNN’s Chris Cuomo this morning. He acknowledged he didn’t anticipate being blindsided by Sen. Kamala Harris over busing but thought his overall civil rights record was strong and the issue had gotten bogged down in the weeds. He thinks that going forward we should be more focused on the future and how we can unite around shared principles/values to move the country in a more progressive direction.
jconway says
Again I think Biden has good intentions and is a good guy. It is going to be very hard for him to be a progressive future oriented guy when he has a record to apologize for of supporting regressive policies in the past and opposing progressive policies better candidates in the field support. He is not the man for the moment.
fredrichlariccia says
I disagree. For me, as an educated white, middle class, proud LGBTQ gay rights activist, grandson of immigrants, parent, and livelong Democratic organizer, Joe Biden is very much a man for this moment..
fredrichlariccia says
Joe Biden on supporting healthcare for undocumented migrants : “How do you say, ‘I’m gonna let you die’. This is just common decency.”
fredrichlariccia says
“NATO may not exist in 5 years if Trump gets re-elected.” Joe Biden
fredrichlariccia says
“My North Star is the middle class.” Joe Biden
doubleman says
He said that, sure. His 40 years of actions show otherwise. It’s been a good schtick for him, though. It’s not quite as laughable as his statements that “no one has a better record on civil rights than me.”
fredrichlariccia says
President Obama must have thought he had a good record on civil rights or he wouldn’t have asked him to be his running mate.
I’ll match Joe Biden’s record on civil rights against Trump’s any day of the week.
fredrichlariccia says
Joe Biden on how to beat Trump: “He’s the bully that I knew my whole life. He’s the bully that I’ve always stood up to. He’s the bully that used to make fun when I was a kid that I stutter and I’d smack him in the mouth.”
SomervilleTom says
Fred, my friend, Joe Biden isn’t running against Donald Trump right now. The more salient question right now is how Mr. Biden’s record on civil rights compares to the other Democratic candidates.
Current polling indicates that each of the front-runners can beat Donald Trump, and the civil rights record of each is far better than that of Mr. Trump.
fredrichlariccia says
I question the strategic wisdom of those that challenge Joe Biden’s civil rights record.
As an activist in LGBTQ rights movement for nearly 40 years, Joe Biden has been an early ally — most recently as the Veep who urged Obama to pass marriage equality.
Our black and brown friends overwhelmingly see him as their champion on the issues that they care about.
So let me be clear. I’ll put Joe Biden’s civil rights record up against any Democratic candidate in the field today and not just that of the Racist-in-Chief.
doubleman says
So, you’re saying that Joe Biden has a better record on LGBTQ rights than other people, like those that opposed DOMA or those that have supported marriage equality for many decades?
Do they? In polling his support among black voters have cut in half since the debate.
The guy says he has the best record. It’s a fine record among longtime Dems. But the best? Come on. And if he wants to say he has the best record, and also that he doesn’t regret anything he’s ever done, then he deserves to have his record thrown in his face.
I’m happy he’s lost a third of his support since joining the race and I hope that trend continues.
I think there is strategic wisdom in having thoroughly vigorous primaries and challenging everyones records. When we try to stop that and anoint favorites from the establishment, we always lose.
fredrichlariccia says
I’m not anointing anyone and I’m not trying to silence intraparty primary debate on the issues.
I am trying to win a general election without killing ourselves in the process.
jconway says
Which is what Kamala Harris and others are also doing by asking legitimate questions of the Vice President and his record. If he can’t handle this criticism from his peers in front of a friendly audience, how can we trust him to take on Trump?
Christopher says
For all this talk about looking to the future why do we insist on rehashing 1970s debates?
SomervilleTom says
Because we have lost ground in the decades since the 1970s.
Whatever the weaknesses of forced busing (and there are many), after five decades we have still not put a better alternative into practice.
Christopher says
Maybe we should push harder for those better (and more politically palatable) alternatives then.
jconway says
Biden is not talking about the future, he is relitigating 2016 and following the same failed strategy of the last Democratic nominee. Tie yourself to Obama and attack Donald Trump. Didn’t work then, won’t work now.
Hillary ran this ad already and it didn’t work. People want to know what you’re for, not what you’re against. To paraphrase a younger Joe Biden’s killer attack on Rudy Giuliani, every sentence Joe speaks is a noun, a verb, and Donald Trump.
None of the other candidates are focusing on Trump, they are focusing on their own agendas on how to fix America. Even the also rans like Inslee and Yang have better thought our plans on how to address the challenges of tomorrow.
Nominating Biden is an exercise in nostalgia for the Obama years, and when you’re running on nostalgia, the less savory aspects of your 45 year record are fair game.
Christopher says
He’s talking a lot about what Trump has done as President, so that’s hardly relitigating 2016. Defeating Trump IMO is priority 1, 2, and 3. We need to show ourselves and the world that 2016 was an aberration. Trump was elected by those who thought he could never win so they could acquiesce to Clinton’s election without actually having to vote for her or thought he would grow in his office. Nobody can be under any illusions on either point now. Biden’s not necessarily the only person who can do this, but the Obama third term is certainly appealing to me so that’s part of why he gets my vote. I choose whom I want to be President rather than strategize over what the party needs. If everyone did likewise then the person whom we nominate will become by definition the person the party needs.
jconway says
Where’s your data on this? The data I’ve exhaustively discussed here shows the same economic and cultural anxiety that drove Trump’s rust belt victories are still driving his support today. Especially among swing voters.
Elizabeth Warren is right when she says we have to show voters we will fix the systems that have screwed them over and make plans to solve their problems. No one would accuse her of going easy on Trump either. Moreover Biden does not have a monopoly on being better prepared and better qualified to be President than Donald Trump.
I wholeheartedly agree which is why I will continue to criticize our candidates where I think they are wrong and praise them where I think they are right. I certainly hope this is something we can continue to do here.
Joe Biden is a good man and was a good Vice President. He is the wrong man to lead our party against Donald Trump.
SomervilleTom says
@push harder:
Absolutely, I don’t think anyone has ever suggested otherwise. The point, though, is that those better alternatives have so far been rejected.
jconway says
Polling shows that when voters are exposed to Biden’s past support of the Iraq War, Bankruptcy Reform, Banks and lending companies, mass incarceration, and free trade bills it depresses turnout with key Democratic demographics. Making him more vulnerable to Donald Trump in a general election.
A majority of Americans oppose endless war, oppose wasting billions on holding minor offenders in private prisons, oppose bailing out banks and lenders while stiffing consumers, and oppose trade bills that benefit Wall Street over Main Street.
The economic agenda Joe Biden supported as a Senator is not dissimilar to the agenda Jeb Bush and Mitt Romney ran on. Center left on social issues and center right on economic and foreign policy issues is not the way to move forward. If anything ,the majority of the electorate is the exact opposite of that. The data is beginning to demonstrate this.
SomervilleTom says
“Bankruptcy reform” is a particularly offensive euphemism. What that meant was to make it nearly impossible for consumers who were (and are) drowning in credit card debt — most often as a consequence of illness, even while covered by insurance — to declare bankruptcy.
The result was that the large financial institutions that reaped HUGE profits by cranking up interest rates, shortening payment cycles, shortening the compounding interval, and skyrocketing late payment fees were able to gouge consumers even more.
It is a textbook case of “democratic fascism” — government bought and paid for by big business using its authority to force already suffering consumers to suffer even more.
I accepted Joe Biden as Barack Obama’s running mate as a political price needed to get mainstream Democrats onboard with the “radical” choice of Mr. Obama (who would have thought that a black Democrat from Chicago would govern somewhere to the right of Richard Nixon).
I am unwilling to embrace Mr. Biden as our nominee. If he wins the primary, I’ll blank that office on my 2020 ballot.
jconway says
I worked at a bankruptcy law firm for three years and 50% of our caseloads were due to medical bankruptcies. The rest were either underwater on their home or car loans, entrapped by payday lenders (thankfully illegal in our state) or gambling addictions (unfortunately legal here now too). Our boss was a real tyrant, but he hated Joe Biden while he praised Elizabeth Warren for literally writing the textbook on bankruptcy law.
Thanks to Biden, we had to run invasive means tests to see if clients qualified. If they didn’t, they had to sell off assets or quit jobs to get under median. Thanks to Biden, all our clients were required to pay another $50-$100 for a credit counseling course funded by the creditors.
Immediately after bankruptcy they get offers to take out new higher interest credit cards to “rebuild their credit”. The entire industry is predicated on fraud and as paralegals we often had to fight the companies to get improperly repossessed assets back and prove that they auto signed loans consumers didn’t even sign up for. We had to fight to change credit scores that were improperly downgraded by the bureaus.
All the poor, predominately black women who took out exorbitant student debt at shady for profit colleges to become $15/hr CNAs or med techs can thank Joe Biden that those loans couldn’t be discharged. Joe Biden created this messed up universe, and when education debt inevitably becomes the next subprime crisis, there is now no safety net for millions of Americans and the federal government on the hook for their debt.
Under Warren or Sanders, that debt goes away and puts $500-1000 a month back in the hands of working people’s pockets. When Warren and Sanders go on the attack and explain this math, the middle class will see that Joe stood up for the bankers and not for them.
jconway says
It’s a good thing we are attacking Biden on policy grounds then.