The saddest news, which mars the great triumph of last night, is that it looks like California, by a slim majority, voted to accept hate and bigotry into their state constitution. It is a huge step back for equal marriage rights, but it’s more personal than that. Today, hundreds of couples in California who yesterday were married, are weeping. Trying to console one another.
The ludicrous system which allows CA residents to vote on civil rights on the ballot, to amend their constitution so easily, has allowed hate to flourish and triumph. The big news is that if a right wing religion from another state spends a decade and millions of dollars, they can rip loved ones apart and take away their dignity, their right to be there for each other at the end of life or in the hospital, they can encode their hate into constitutional law.
But this is a marathon, as I have said elsewhere. This is not over. To my gay brothers and sisters, I say, mourn today. And I give this advice. Don’t leave your pain in the dark, with your friends and allies and partners. Let the country see what they have done. Let the sundering of the civil bond between already married partners in California shine in the spotlight. Let them see your sorrow. At work, on the television, at the movies, on the street, in the park. Let them see you cry. Don’t hide from this hate. Show us how you love. How you hurt.
I say that if you do not shrink back from this, if you boldly come before Californians, the American people with your heart showing, there will be a backlash against hate. There will be human beings who will see themselves in your shoes, though they never thought to change their attitude or be your ally. Yours is the human story, a human struggle. Let us see.
As I write this, my throat’s constricted, my eyes are wet. Let them feel it. Let them see. Let them see.
And can be, will be, amended again.
Get to work, and I mean real work. I know you’re trying to be encouraging, but frankly such words do more damage than good unless they’re matched with “and here is how WE will accomplish that…”. We do need encouragement. But more than that, we need straight people who get off their asses and act. I don’t mean to insinuate that you didn’t/don’t, but MY ENTIRE FAMILY failed to help during the NO on Prop 8 other than to lend a sympathetic ear. Well, the sympathetic ear is full of shit, if you ask me. So please, do be encouraging, but be encouraging by showing some drive and intention, not a sunny but lazy disposition.
In any event, I think, realistically, it is going to take a little time. I dislike the manner in which SSM was achieved in California, as I did here in Massachusetts. The margin was as pro-SSM as any referenda, anywhere, ever, to my knowledge, and I would consider the trend to be encouraging, even if disappointing.
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p>I suspect that after a breather, there will be a regrouping and rallying of troops, and a renewed effort. I do hope that the litigation strategy (amendment or revision?) is eschewed, as I suspect it will be counterproductive. When that renewed effort comes, I will consider donating, even though political donating is something that I am, generally, absolutely loathe to do.
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p>The character of that campaign will matter to me. As I view this as a campaign for political rights, it should be conducted, in my view, in the political arena, and only in the political arena. I therefore will not donate to support lawyer’s fees for some renewed constitutional challenge.
I guess if you’re in the business of advertising and make money off of politics, sure, have another vote every chance you get. But, it’s better to accept that Californians just decided this issue for a while, and it’s not going to be different next year (well, if you snuck it past the citizens in a off year election maybe it’d be different, but again, that’s disrespectful of the people). Maybe in ten years it stops being disrespectful and you could try again, but by then something new might have happened federally or something, making it unnecessary.
If they had that much to spare, they weren’t doing anything useful with it anyway. Might as well keep the media afloat with it.
and if California is a loss (I wish it won’t be but it may be the inevitable) then we need to learn something. Until we stop being the victims and become individually pro-active in this civil rights fight, we will not step over the next treshold.
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p>LGBT need to wear our orientation, our families, our place, our American citizenship, our humanity on our sleeves and on our foreheads every day, 24 hours a day. A good many of us did this in Massachusetts. But there is a fine line between listening to our national leaders like the HRC and the statewide equality groups and expecting them to fight for us and feeling that our necessary involvement stops at writing a check or sending an email. And personal activism like so many of us did here in the early days of our marriage fight and letting the electorate know that we are a force with which to be reckoned.
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p>Until LGBT fight with all our might, from the heart, from our souls, until we fight back like we ARE equal, like we ARE Americans, we will not succeed. I think the time of giving massive amounts of money to organizations like the HRC is over and it is time to fight back via rogue LGBT organizations, extreme advertising, and turning the conversation inward to our own which hopefully will give fellow LGBT the “permission” to fight back in ways that will not only rock our straight neighbors but will rock the corporate LGBT “leadership” mentality.
advertising. We posted cutesy ads poking fun at them wanting to get involved in private matters. They posted ads essentially saying we were trying to spread teh gay in Californian schools to eight year olds. It was disgusting.
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p>The ad campaign for No on 8 should have went after them from the beginning. It should have discredited all of their leaders. It should have completely stripped any trust the people of California would have for them.
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p>The ad campaign to repeal this incredibly hateful, hurtful and disastrous amendment must begin now and be every bit as harsh as I described. People should feel exactly as poorly as what they did to us – stripped us of our rights. Everyone who voted for that must know that what they did is homophobic. There’s no excuse.
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p>And we must follow all of this up with millions and millions of grassroot gay people, parents of gay people, brothers and sisters, friends, etc. We need to show people that we’re normal, not trying to convert their kiddies and just want to have an ordinary, equal chance in life. That’s it. Just the chance.
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p>I hope this horrible ban won’t stand for long and that the people who ran No on 8 will either get real, or allow the grown ups to get in charge. We can’t treat people who want to strip our rights as though they aren’t there, or that they’re harmless or that even all of them can be convinced. The ones who can’t – the leaders and most fringe wingers – need to be aired out in front of everyone, so they realize just how hateful and hurtful and spiteful they are. We did that in Massachusetts with MassResistance and by putting the signatures of people who signs amendments online… and both of those things are part of why we won. It must be replicated as close as possible everywhere.
with my idea to put the names on lines here the reaction I got (as Arline Isaacson had already pushed this idea but was voted out) was one of “we need to tread lightly” or we will make them martyrs and then lose. I really tried to get MassEquality, the HRC and even the Task Force to understand that before we can ask others to help fight for us that we need to strengthen our own people first.
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p>There were so many factors at play in Massachusetts. What KnowThyNeighbor did to help besides posting the names and showing the other side that we mean business was that we within KTN kept the pot stirring and others in Massachusetts did the same. Ryan I think that you really get it, I have the greatest respect for you.
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p>It is time to fight. If you feel compelled to give money give it to GLAD or other organizations that need funding for lawsuits. But now is the time to take your money and develop your own websites, buy your own signs, pay for gas to get you to protests, etc… Don’t be afraid to rock the boat or ruffle feathers in major ways. These attacks against LGBT are personal.
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p>If you were standing in line and someone cut in front of you, you would say something, you may even get angry. If you were shopping and just put this really incredible shirt in your cart, the last one on the rack, and someone reached in the cart, took it out laughed at you and walked to the cashier with it, you would yell, try to grab it back, you may even get physical. And most people witnessing this would say you were justified or at least say that they would probably have done the same thing…
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p>And yet, amendments and laws are being created that hurt us directly, hurt our families, our children and tell us everyday that we are inferior, immoral, less than. And that America is not America for us…and what do we do? I’ll leave it at that.
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p>Every action against us requires AT LEAST an equal if not great reaction from us!
and I agree, taking it nice and slow and easy just means your opponent walks all over you.
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p>But there’s also convincing those people, like my mom, who are perfectly nice people who have never internalized empathy for gay people as “human beings with feelings.” To her, gay is an abstract. No one in my family is gay, no one is personally affected. Therefore, she has no personal experience to go on.
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p>Seeing gay couples in CA coping with this tragedy of losing this right on TV, watching her favorite show which has a sympathetic gay character she can laugh and cry with, that has more impact than any fightin’ brawl you can take to the haters. Those are the people who will help you win.
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p>Not that I agree with the HRC types per se, but just…be careful that you balance the fight with telling the poignant human story of your normalness and humanity.
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p>I am convinced that the reason gay marriage is so safe in MA isn’t just because we’re teh liberal. It’s also because average people with little experience with gay people in their lives saw groups of happy, crying, married people on the steps of city halls on the news for weeks. They realized, OMG, these people just wanna be boringly normal! They ARE like me!
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p>In that respect, the more gays feel they can reveal their orientation the better. I know it’s hard – which comes first, the safe atmosphere for gays to come out as such or the gays coming out in order to make it more normal and hence safe to come out? But it must needs be taken to main street.
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p>And that’s a very different thing from marching up and down a small town in a big in your face gay pride parade, you know?
but when KnowThyNeighbor published the names of the anti-gay marriage petition signers, my organization was sent thousands of stories from individuals who found that their mother or father, grandmother, college roommate, best friend, co-workers, person who was in their wedding party legitimately signed the petition. These people knew a gay person, knew a gay person very very close to their lives.
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p>Stories are good, but the stories cannot be written by organizations like HRC or the other equality groups. You are right in that the silver bullet is the conversation. But the conversation is not a sound bite or an ad, one that went through months of focus groups and corporate approval. We need to empower LGBT and give them permission to fight back.
But again, if you lose sight of the powerful nature of those news reports, of Will and Grace, or any number of other (both “scripted” and not scripted exposures in pop culture of gay life) you might find yourself still losing.
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p>The meat is in the squishy middle…those are the people, if you get them on your side, You. Just. Win.
but we so often forget the “radical” side more than we forget the warm and fuzzy side.
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p>America is a society based confrontation and winning. Social hierarchy and perceived strength. LGBT cannot forget that. At KnowThyNeighbor, my co-director, Aaron Toleos, who was awarded The Advocate’s “Cool Straight alond with Arianna Huffington and Kate Blanchette (only 7 honors), posed it like this… “if someone were attacking my family, my wife, my children…what do you think I (Aaron) would do?”
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p>Quite frankly, I do not think the majority of LGBT fully understand what equality is or means. I know that is a harsh statement to some, but I have seen this firsthand. And I have been there too believe me.
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we are in violent agreement here, then? đŸ™‚
can go round and round, and everyone will be right to a degree. But the thing is, you can never expect an ad campaign to change peoples closely held bigoted views in just a few months. poorly-targeted ads may not have helped the campaign, but they didn’t lose the campaign for us. bigot voters lost us the campaign. the pr has to start eons before the vote takes place. california has decades of history of constitutional attack on gays and a very open gay community. you might say they’ve been living their pr for decades. i’m not sure what more could have been done honestly. if people decide to be mormon or catholic, no ad will dissuade them. if people decide to be hateful, no ad will dissuade them. judging others harshly is apparently part and parcel with being american for many people, the only way to combat this, in my view, is from the top from an authority figure. and now that we have jim crobama as the next authority figure, i fell our prospects are zero. unless, of course, he is given notice by his core supporters that he will start acting like a real civil rights advocate. allies? what is your plan? how are you going to make the man beholden to you do the right thing?
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p>I personally know dozens of Catholics who support gay marriage. But then, this post certainly isn’t the first time you’ve failed to respect that the Catholic laity is incredibly diverse in thought and deed. Personally, I find your tone about the issue to be quite a turn off, but we’ve hashed that out too. Throwing out phrases like “jim crowbama” the day after he won the POTUS race just isn’t going to help you make new allies.
I was just trying to convey that some people cannot be shaken from their belief choices by mere ads. I used religions as a type illustration of how firm people’s belief choices are, and that homophobia can be as firmly rooted as religion. I actually did not mean to imply that all Catholics or Mormons are bigots, although the CA debacle did show that a large swath of the LDS church won’t say no to bigotry.
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p>But now that you mentioned it đŸ™‚ in fact the Mormons have been coordinating with the Catholic church on this subject for at least 10 years, until now letting the RCC be the public front. I know that that it is the hierarchy doing the coordination, not the rank and file, but in a sense the LDS rank and file are the hierarchy, so it’s not so easy to let LDS rank and file off the hook. Some LDS members did stray from the church orders in CA. They are noteworthy for their teeny tiny numbers. The LDS structure does not tolerate strays like the Catholic church does, and punishes in a way I’m sure makes the Pope envious (I remember him saying early on how he would rather expel all those who aren’t strict adherents.).
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An extension of what Lynne and Ryan have posted… bring out the youtubes.
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p>The CA GLBT groups need to get as many heartbroken Californians to start speaking into their web cam. Right now. Record what this decision has done to your family right now, before you’ve stopped crying. Before the agony has numbed.
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p>People need to see what they’ve done. They must see the foolish and unintentional destruction they’ve caused. I believe that when they do see personal stories of families being legally ripped apart, their hearts will soften. They need to see the wedding photos of beautiful brides and handsome grooms surrounded by their families and friends on their wedding days and how on November 4th the voters decided that it never happened. When they do, in raw emotional footage, their hearts will soften. They must soften.
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p>They’ll see it if it’s on the youtubes.
Expose the haters as much if not more than those who the hate was directed towards. Trust me, what we saw in Massachusetts was the importance of people like Brian Camenker having meltdowns. The crazed haters and the things they say need to be rooted out and exposed. The strength of this fight is to show the real face and the real ignorance of the anti-gays.
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p>Why do you think Kris Mineau distanced himself from Camenker? Why do you think VoteOnMarriage did not allow handmade signs at protests? Why do you think that they did not want us to call them “bigots?” Why do you think that The Catholic Citizenship reached out to KnowThyNeighbor to join with them in a letter asking Fred Phelps not to come to Massachusetts (which we refused to do)? Because they do not want the real face of their movement to be seen.
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p>Get and compile all the ridiculous, nasty, lying hurtful things they said in California and youtube those. There is more power in videos of the bigots for our side
I contend that almost none of the 51ish percent who voted yes on 8 feel any sort of connection with Westboro. Sure, both groups supported yes on 8, but that’s where the relationship stops.
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p>Good people can disagree with good people.
Good people can agree with bad people.
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p>I believe you win this cultural battle over love by highlighting love, not by highlighting hate. Love is a human condition, and something we long to have. It’s also more powerful than hate or fear.
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p>My grandmother and her old maid sister are “old school” New York conservatives. They’re also very religious and anti gay. Not Westboro in your face anti gay; rather the more passive aggressive, quiet, “we’ll pray for you” anti gay. My wife and I were talking about marriage in Massachusetts, and they of course were against it.
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p>Then my wife pointed out how important it was for Nana to visit Pop Pop in the hospital, regardless of the time of day. She pointed out how Nana and Pop Pop filed joint tax returns and how both could pick up my mom or her sisters from school and how Nana has received a social security check since Pop Pop died all those years ago. Had Pop Pop died without a will Nana wouldn’t have been in a lurch. My wife then pointed out that all of these things help a family get by, just as Nana’s family got by all those years.
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p>I don’t think my Nana supports gay marriage. After that conversation though, I don’t think she’d have voted yes on 8. She’s seen just a glimpse of how marriage rights and responsibilities help a loving family get by, and may be beginning to think that all American loving families deserve those rights.
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p>Showing her hatred won’t change her heart. Showing her love has.
Get at the crazies and expose them (a la light of day) AND get heartwarming stories in front of the squishy middle who aren’t really all that bad as people, but who are very misguided?
Attorney General Jerry Brown intends to challenge this
The result of this omission is clear. There are according to the proposition now 3 classes of people in California:
1. opposite sex couples who are or can get married
2. same sex couples who are currently married
3. same sex couples who can’t get married
The existence of classes 2 and 3 is inconsistent with the state’s constitution and the US Constitution.
Let’s hope the thing gets thrown out on this basis so that we can move forward. Just like here in Massachusetts, as people get used to the idea of same-sex marriage, intolerance decreases.
An international joke for 40 years and counting.
My favorite rendition of Jerry Brown was in a little covered version of a song by the punk rock band “The Dead Kennedys” released on their 1984 LP “Fresh Fruit For Rotting Vegetables”.
Enjoy đŸ™‚
http://www.deadkennedys.com/al…
Can we be so lucky? That would be great!
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p>And then we can all be prepared (with donations, organization, media coverage) when the Mormons invade CA the next time around. Cuz they will.
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p>But that winning margin was pretty damn thin. I think better org and money earlier on would have won this this for equality.
Get ready to defend equality against constitutional attacks in IA, WA and perhaps NJ and NY as well. CA was the most important place to hold firm, but it wasn’t by any means the last. Now that the haters have this huge victory under their belt, they’ll be cleaning up the random stragglers. Are you prepared? What are you doing in anticipation of these coming fights?
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p>Count your lucky stars that CT voted down the opportunity to have a constitutional convention.
The issue is that the first line of defense/offense is the groups on the ground in those states. Do you know the state of the orgs there?
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p>There’s been some serious suggestions that MA organizers need to export their successful tactics into other states. Obviously not everything will translate but a lot of it will. Training on grassroots ground game, media tactics, responses to hate, etc, could all come in handy for those orgs, but only if they can get this training NOW NOW NOW.
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p>What about starting training groups in MA, and housing other states’ gay activists here to come to extensive organizational development and campaigning trainings, as well as strategic sessions that overlay what happened in MA with what could happen in their states?
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p>I am pretty broke, and pretty pressed for time with all the things I volunteer for, but I would be willing to host a training in my town and out of staters in my home for such a thing were it to happen. And find others in my area to also do so (after all, I have a lot of friends and allies here.)
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p>If someone put something together like that, and hosting it in my area was promising (better in Boston probably but still) I would be willing to help find the venue, free housing, etc, things that are in my purview to do well.
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p>Just a thought.
I’m not thinking in specifics at the moment, just conceptually. And the concept I’m forming goes something like this: Straight people, being the majority of the voting population, own this travesty of justice. But just as straight people need to be held accountable for letting this happen to fellow citizens, straight people need to find a reason to buy in to the solution so that they can take ownership of the future victory.
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p>How to get straight people to want to own this particular victory is of course the difficult part. How do you make someone act about something that doesn’t affect them personally, but that bothers them in theory? Well, I tried the following on my neighbor this afternoon to great effect: a direct laying on the line of the following, in so many words: “Stop telling me that we gays still have more work to do. We make up only 5% of the population. It is straight people who are casting these votes while good straight people stand by silently. It is YOU who has work to do. It isn’t enough to be sympathetic to my plight. You belong to the MCC. How many of your fellow parishoners did you call to motivate to balance out the Mormons? How many people have you talked to this week to tell them why it is important to YOU that all people be treated equally by the law? How many of YOUR friends even know you’re an LGBT ally?”
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p>In my experience, having straight people sit down and hear personally from gays why marriage (or fair treatment under the law in any form) is important to them is very powerful. So I’m thinking the most powerful next tool is to organize straight people to do the same. It seems that straight people rarely think to witness to each other about what this means to them, as to why they want to live in a just world. We LGBTs have to keep coming out and working hard, and we will. But it isn’t our burden to shoulder alone. It is your burden too, and I intend to not let any of you forget it ever again. đŸ™‚
since gays make up the majority of the population, it is essential that heteros fight the good fight. This is true for tactical reasons, but also for moral ones: the majority must defend the rights of the majority.
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p>I just don’t see how your tone will be effective.
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p>Consider
Choice A: “It is YOU who has work to do.”
Choice B: “Please join US in the work.”
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p>Choice A is an index finger poking into my chest. Choice B is a pair of open arms. I believe that you get more flies with honey than with vinegar.
That best reflects my personality. The trouble is that it doesn’t work with enough people. My own family is a great example. I’ve been asking them please for almost 30 years. They smile and love me and support me, but they won’t help me. Well, after 30 years, it’s time to start raising my voice. I frequently have a similar experience with other straight people. They are sympathetic, think it’s terrible what’s being done to gays, but won’t respond to “please” by actually doing anything about the situation. They just won’t. But some will respond to a poke in the chest. So I try A first, but now I’m going to fall back on B without hesitation. I have nothing more to lose.
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p>Can you think of ways for allies to enlist more allies. And by allies, I mean not just people who will vote the right way, but people who will talk to their neighbors and do the leg work? We need to become the new evangelicals. How do we do that?
and for people over 30, I don’t really know the answer. How did it get done in MA? Why did the progressive heteros help? Given limited resources, why marriage and not wind power or unions or NCLB issues or somesuch? One thing I do think is effective is for state legislators to communicate directly with their constituents and be very clear that it’s so important and that they’ve got to enlist in the fight.
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p>I think on this issue the sympathetic heterosexuals need leadership. Maybe that’s from their state rep. Maybe that’s from Ellen DeGeneres. Maybe it’s from Greg Louganis. Maybe it’s from their church leaders. Maybe this large group of apathetic supporters need to be poked/pushed by a leader of theirs.
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p>For people under 30, it’s a bit different. Those which are politically active tend not to have the hangups that their elders have. “Teh gay” is completely normal for them, and marriage is an obvious logical extension of the normalcy of homosexuality. The question is — how do you get them to do anything at all?
It has been well documented that exposure to differing ideas through actual personal experience breeds tolerance. This is why kids tend to be a little more liberal by the time they leave college than when they entered (not ‘indoctrination’). More to the point, my guess is that GLBT students and professors are more likely to be ‘out’ in the northeast than elsewhere,… possibly creating a multiplier effect toward exposure (and therefore, empathy).
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p>My theory is that our well educated population created a pool of citizens well disposed to have enough empathy to bolster a civil rights movement. This is important to fully understand though, because if it is right then the models of advocacy that worked well in MA might not work well in places with differing demographics.
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p>I don’t have empirical data, but that is my hunch.
we may need to do things somewhat differently. the eastern half of the state is still pretty rough, and teachers (for example) aren’t always willing to be out even thought they have legal protection. and we even have megachurch anti-gays here on the liberal side. on the other hand, the libertarianism bent in the state should be useful. anyway, your caution about what works there won’t necessarily work elsewhere is a good one.
you know, i hadn’t considered asking legislators to take an active leadership roll with their constituents. i always thought of it in the opposite – the voters need to beg/persuade the legislator. but in solid districts, you may be right. this might be a good way to activate people to work in neighboring not-so-solid districts.
If the onus is laid at our feet alone, as it has been all along, we will never advance. It is the heterosexual world that passed 4 more discriminatory amendments last night. There are too many of you and too few of us. If YOU don’t daily push the story of YOUR anguish at seeing YOUR brothers and sisters being stripped of their citizenship, then I give up. Obama didn’t refuse to take a clear stand against these amendments because of the LGBTs, he did it because he didn’t believe that LGBTs have meaningful allies. And in the functional sense, he was right. You all are out there and have done a lot of work alongside us, but you’re too silent when it counts. You are willing to wager that the country will elect a black guy with the middle name Hussein, but not a constitutional scholar who takes a principled stand for equal protection of the laws. I lay the burden at your feet.
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p>Seeing this diary did more for me than you can imagine, Lynne, and I thank you for it. But I’m challenging you and other allies to change the focus. Yes, we LGBTs have to keep working and keep coming out and keep up the public conversation. But we need every ally to get serious in stepping up to the plate and doing the same, not just thinking casting a ballot and giving $20 dollars is enough. YOU need to come out to new people daily. This is not only vital in terms of your superior numbers and resources, but also simply because too many of us are emotional wrecks after lifetimes of being beaten down. Sometimes we just can’t speak for ourselves. I know many gay people who won’t talk to neighbors or legislators because they can;t stand the prospect of more rejection and judgment, or because it is quite literally dangerous to their job or safety to do so. Only Allies can soften such barriers.
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p>After last night, I quite honestly don’t know if I can stand the fight any longer. I’ve lived under this regime for 45 years. There have been important advances, but they are piecemeal and come at a glacial pace. I still cannot reconcile the joy of seeing this country elect a non-white person, and seeing BHO, with his family history, stumping for Jim Crow and doing irreparable damage. And watching his supporters, our supposed allies and many LGBTs too, make excuses for him every step of the way. I just don’t know what to do with that. I am so hurt and angry.
that I didn’t mention how many LGBT are just so beaten down by the prospect of fighting.
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p>We can ask Lynne and other straight allies to help us, but it is up to us to help ourselves. We have to do the asking and never accept being told to wait a while or to accept that “there are so many other more important issues out there.” And we need to immediately disallow anyone from criticizing us as “one issue people or voters.”
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p>LGBT just like many abuse victims most often find that the abusers are the ones we love or the people closest to us. And really we can blame the abusers, but we need to look to ourselves to stop the abuse.
God I sympathize. I can’t even imagine the let down and the hurt.
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p>I lost a bunch of my pins and other visible daily signs of outward support for gay rights over time, but I will renew that commitment (I proudly wore those pins everywhere I went), and that of spreading the word (I can do a lot of good, I think, in my little conservative family in the state to the north). For starters.
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p>And please, please don’t give up. Can you imagine the setbacks that Stanton and Anthony had? They didn’t live to see their dream realized, but the groundwork they laid made our rights as women possible. The black civil rights struggle was brutal and people were jailed and died, but we are who we are as a nation, with Obama our president-elect, because of them. And I think you will not have to wait too much longer for the tidal wave of equality you rightfully expect.
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p>I can’t even tell you how rapid the last 15 years of gay rights advancement feels to me. When I was a teen in the 90s, it was still hard to be openly gay in high school. That has so changed. My grandparents’ generation are decidedly antigay. Their kids’ generation (including Obama and the rest) find it hard to be completely openly pro-gay. My generation is pretty gay-friendly on average, and I see a lot of my peers (when they can be bothered to care about anything political at all, the apathetic morons) on our side. And I’ll be damned if there’s not a vast majority of young people, YOU know, those young people who are VERY motivated voters, who are so completely comfortable with “teh gay” that the future is looking inevitable to me. From where I stand, it’s not whether, but when.
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p>We have Connecticut. And possibly New York. Civil unions, while not perfect, are cropping up in weird states like NH. The movement is spreading. I know a setback as large as California must feel like the world spinning. But I’m looking at the margin of passage in CA on prop 8, and the freaking insane level of organization for Yes on 8 that the Mormons and their allies mounted, and the last-minute disarray of the No on 8 org, and though we lost, Laural, oh my god, it’s not permanent. It’s so very temporary. Just you wait and see.
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p>It must be so hard to be patient after so long. I can’t imagine. But we can do this.
I guess all of those amendments happened because we didn’t show enough gay couples hugging.
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p>Seriously, we need a really good documentary on what REALLY happened here in Massachusetts before its too late.
Massachusetts was a combination of a major legal challenge by GLAD, hardwork setting the foundations by Isaacson and the MGLPC, good press both active and passive, PR with the plaintiff couples and other couples, Lobbying by Isaacson and her crew, MassEquality generating the massive electoral response, voting for pro-equality candidates, the tri-umvirate (Patrick, Murray, Dimasi), KnowThyNeighbor stirring the pot and all the work on the petition fraud and keeping this in the news for 2 years, timing timing timing (the length of time for the electorate to digest this), and all of the work that LGBT and equality supporters did based on the fact that all of the former kept the topic in motion.
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p>To say simply that showing the love wins over the hearts and minds of the electorate is just wrong. It is one aspect but not the sole answer.
MA trainers to go out to all the other states and show them the methods that can work the most effectively.
Are you serious about this? Could be a good project to produce with cable access resources…(I’m a member of Lowell’s)
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p>I don’t have the camera experience, but I wonder if a bunch of us couldn’t produce something? Put together a documentary team, and find the people to interview? You already wrote up a synopsis there, who the players were, etc. Seems like a good place to start.
I like the idea that the documentary be done from an independent source.
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p>Courting Equality the book ie Pat Gozemba, Marilyn Humphries and Karen Kahn put together a great summary of the SSM movement here in Massachusetts. Unfortunately, the movie “Saving Marriage” is not a documentary of the movement but it documents mostly MassEquality’s role and the invovlement of the coalition. It not only left out KnowThyNeighbor, but it left out the Governor, Therese Murray and Dimasi.
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p>We need an independent documentation of what happened here, and opinions of what happened here. The opinions leave other states with the options to try many things.
I’d be happy to help write/advise a project like this.
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p>Wonder how many LTC’ers I could pull into doing tech work…
More gay marriage prohibition means more tourism to MA.
Combine that with the new sensible marijuana policy… “Massachusetts – gay marriage and one ounce of marijuana. Make it yours!”
in order to continue to have their marriage recognized by their state. If they stay in California, they won’t be married. This could drive up real estate prices here significantly. Don’t take the first offer! All those empty homes on the market around here will soon be occupied by 18,000 grateful gay couples.
my below post to you as well.
missed me, sucka
inappropriate. I get what you’re trying to do, but it really just fail.
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p>People are really hurting here.
4 hate amendments were passed yesterday.
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p>This brings us to a total of 30 anti-marriage equality constitutional amendments, and one gratuitous “save the children!” constitutional amendment. A federal constitutional amendment is a few ratifying states away. God I love this country, where all it take is for good people to do nothing!
Why is it so simple to amend a state constitution in these places? Civil Rights should never be left to a majority decision of the electorate. If that were the case then, interracial marriage would have been declared unconstitutional in the deep South in 1967. This fight should be fought at the Federal Supreme Court level under the equal rights protection clause of the constitution. Problem is that Republicans have been appointing over the past 8 years. Still Civil Rights needs to be fought in the Courts first, before it can be fought at the ballot box.
it’s simple to amend the amendment. That it’s simple is the good news, because that means it will be sooner that we’ll have the electoral strength to amend it again.
How many newly minted young organizers we can snag now that the Obama campaign has seasoned them up and doesn’t need them any more?
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p>Anyone thought to go through former volunteer lists for Obama in many states to ask some of them to be active for gay rights?
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p>Obama’s Obama, and his generation, while not a lost cause, will NOT lead on this issue. (They just aren’t ready to yet.) But we can go AROUND them, bypass them, etc.
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p>I’d offer my generation but as aforementioned, they are a bunch of political pansies.
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p>I should start a political activist group, “Recruit the Missing Generation”…
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p>Anyway, the young gen are all so much better on this issue than their elders are.
We know that GLAD wants to attack DOMA and is in the process of a national move. And the Supreme Court wanted to see how the SSM issue plays out nationally, well here is a clear example. 16,000 couples got married in California, they finally felt included in America, they could protect themselves, their assets, their children, their lives and it probably is going to be ripped away from them.
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p>Talk about the disenfranchised being excluded from constitutional protections that they once had just because some people (a majority of those who voted just barely a majority) just didn’t like them. It is time for the Supreme Court.
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p>And fuck any of those politicians from Congress to anyone in the White House who say that every state should have the right to determine if its okay to discriminate against one group ie determine its own marriage laws to exclude gays. Fuck them and stop fucking supporting them. And if we find that we need to support them because we have no better choice then at least LGBT should have the guts, the balls, the standards to voice openly and loudly our discontent with said politician.
for $ 5000 a ticket you get to see Suzie Orman, the Queer Eye for the Straight Guy guys, the cast of Will and Grace, and maybe even listen to Cyndi Lauper. Equalitinis are free until 9pm!!!!
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p>Angrily, just doing a parody, that isn’t far from what will probably happen
“The disunion of one man and one woman, who shalleth than be weddeth perhaps to another one man or one woman (or perhaps not), which of courseth is the outcome of 50% of our most blessed and sacrosanct heterosexual marriages, although that doth not maketh them neither any less holy nor less utterly and blessedly superior to those abominable ‘gay unions’…”
A lot of them would LOVE to ban divorce, birth control, etc…