Blue Mass Group

Reality-based commentary on politics.

Of honey and vinegar

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So, the convention’s over, and it certainly seemed like a big success to me. Everybody came off well; we have three decent candidates; several excellent speeches; graciousness all around, including the gracious agreement of the Silbert camp to a voice vote for the LG endorsement … All considered, we’re in good shape.

So, what’s with the residual bitterness of some posters here? I find myself agreeing with two posts: Tim Little’s call to quit the uh, complaining, and Publius’ “Politics ain’t beanbag.” Both of these posts stress the importance of playing hard, within the rules, without hard feelings.

The “sad commentary” is that for some Patrick supporters, apparently a sweeping 58% victory and convention endorsement wasn’t enough last weekend. Complaining that the “spirit” of the rules was broken in June will not get one single vote in September. Suck it up. Move on. Your candidate already has:

“Look, I came from nearly nothing to a decisive victory in the convention, so I feel, sure, I would have liked every single vote, but I’ll get every single one by the time of the primary — or at least enough to win.”

To Deval supporters: Do you believe him, or not?

Look, every person who is active in a campaign is a representative of their candidate. To everyone (including our LG fraysters): You will not get more votes for your candidate by crushing your opposition with invective on the BMG boards. You want to be as sweetly sane as possible, in order to attract people to your candidate. If you must attack, attack bad ideas, not people.

As the poet says:

As far as possible without surrender

be on good terms with all persons.

Speak your truth quietly and clearly;

and listen to others,

even the dull and the ignorant;

they too have their story.

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Comments

  2. I really don’t see any significant ideas coming from Gabrieli. Really. I don’t.

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    His cynical campaign tactics, unfortunately, seem to have been borrowed from the Republican playbook. And he is not the only Democrat guilty of executing this ethically vacant strategy.

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    And, Charley, I do not appreciate the patronizing tone you use to address Deval Patrick’s supporters here. “Residual bitterness”? “Suck it up”?! “Do you believe him or not?”?!

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    The Patrick delegates and the rest of the campaign staff have been working extremely hard for a long time, a lot longer than Gabrieli, so at least let them vent a little for a few days after the convention. Worry not, Charley. We will be ready for the primary.

    • No candidate or campaign has the luxury to vent. And as I said, I don’t see any reason to vent. And I don’t know what “tactics” you’re referring to.

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      Deval volunteers need to keep it positive — and coming out of the convention, they have every reason to be positive.

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      blockquote> I really don’t see any significant ideas coming from Gabrieli. Really. I don’t.

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      I’m sure you’ll have some uncharitable things to say about these, but at least you can’t pretend they don’t exist:

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      1. A billion-dollar, ten-year investment in science, with half of that going to stem-cell research. 

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      2. A Biomedical Institute for Discovery at UMass’ Worcester campus.

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      3. A Science and Technology Director in the governor’s office.

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      4. Establishing revenue benchmarks in order to safely manage the return of the state income tax to 5%.

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      5. Making contributions to state college savings plans tax-deductible.

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      6. His latest, a seven-point good-governance deal with voters. Not just rhetorical, it includes real changes like long-term budgeting, expanded online government, and regular town hall meetings all over the state.

      • That’s the kind of talk I’m referring to, Cannoneo. Does that make John feel good about you or Chris G?

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        Sorry to be all schoolmarmish about this, but it’s important.

        • You just got through telling people to get over it…yet John has the burning need to toss one more over the wall.  Cannoneo merely posted a good rebuttal to poor sweet John’s precious, oh so precious post….and you call him on it.  There were no invectives or slander – just a good old fashioned rebuttal. 

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          Pass the tea-towels, girls.  Evidently, we’re all in for a good cry over this still. 

          • I agree.

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            I think saying that Gabrieli doesn’t have any good ideas is not being constructive. Personally, I was amused to see the comment in a thread about the importance of civility.

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            In any event, I’m not sure I get the broader point here. There is still a vigorous primary campaign to be contested. The time for unity is after the Party chooses a nominee.

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            Civility, of course, is always important, but the lack thereof is mostly a result, I think, of the anonymity we allow than anything else — and the fact that our ratings system is not working at the moment — and no amount of pleading will eliminate it.

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            Could I have a tea towel, please :~-(

            • What was the Warner Brothers cartoon with the overly polite chipmunks?

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              “I think saying that Gabrieli doesn’t have any good ideas is not being constructive.”

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              Gabs touts himself as the idea man.
              I really can’t believe Bob’s and Charley’s positions here about attitude.
              Schoolmamaish is being nice.

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              Mr. Rogers looks like Animal House when reading this thread and seeing what you guys think is appropriate attitude.

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          • Except for stem cell (got anything else, Gabs?) it’s just a list of technocratic band-aids as far as I am concerned.

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            Again, a 5-, or 6-, or 10-point list is not the same thing as a vision. Unfortunately, we seem to have forgotten that in the era of George W. Bush and Mitt “PowerPoint” Romney.

            • You asked for ideas; how are you defining “idea”?

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              Re-centering the biotech economy in Worcester isn’t an idea? Long-term budgeting isn’t an idea? Benchmarking the income tax isn’t an idea?

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              Now you say you meant a “vision.” Is a vision really more desirable than a set of ideas and skills informed by a particular background and worldview? I’ll grant you that a vision can inspire people. Ronald Reagan had a vision and brilliantly communicated it. But a lot of people hear “vision” and they think ideology, or they hear nonspecific utopian rhetoric. Going up against Healey, I think competence and experience will be big issues – the state’s in the mood for a smart, nonpolarizing doer, not a prophet.

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              Regarding the topic of this post, I think this exchange between John and me is an example of sharp but civil argument.

            • Chris Gabrieli is a millionaire who actually commits his resources to the community.  Personally, he has affected the lives of thousands of youth in Boston Public Schools through not only developing a plan to create more out of school time opportunities, but then actually bringing funding together and implementing this plan.  It is not merely ideas with him – he does something about it.

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              I am truly happy that I have made the effort to separate Mr. Patrick from those supporters (some of them whom I thought of as friends in the past) who actually yelled at me for wearing a Gabrieli pin at the convention.  Bad mouthing Chris Gabrieli is certainly going to do nothing to endear me to Deval Patrick.  So, while I would vote for Mr. Patrick should he win the primary, I certainly will not give the same volunteer effort that I am giving to Chris, merely because Mr. Patrick’s supporters have been so mean to me.  And, incidentally, none of my friends on the Reilly team yelled at me for wearing a Gabrieli pin!  Just something to think about.

          • insofar as it had facts. But again, if Gab wins, Cannoneo is going to be looking for John’s vote in November. So much more reason to play nice.

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            And yeah, I’ll take one of those tea towels.

  3. My comment in a previous “complaining about the convention” post sums up my feelings on this. Sorry, but I don’t have the time to re-write anything:

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    Win lose or draw, agree or disagree, we have a ticket in front of us. All three candidates are on. It’s not going to change.

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    I speak as a Patrick supporter who was mad as hell at some of the things that went on, particularly the misleading “lend us your vote” calls.

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    It’s Wednesday, June 7th. The convention is over. We all did what we had to do on Saturday, and we all need to continue doing it going forward. Let’s play the game and play hard, instead of complaining about our opponents.

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    I’ve seen people say that continuing to complain about what took place makes Patrick supporters look bad. I think they’re right, and I for one am done with that. I’ll work my ass off for Deval from right now until the primary, and if he is not the voter’s choice I will work my ass off for whoever is until the general. I hope we can all agree to do the same.

  4. This whole thing is getting ridiculous.

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    Don’t poke a guy in the eye today and then try to ask for his vote or his help tomorrow.

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    The eye-pokers on all sides are only helping Kerry Healey.

    • I agree with sco and Charley that a more pleasant demeanor is a good thing.  There is no point in being overly negative, we just hurt each other and our candidates.  However, the “eye poking” shouldn’t stop.  I am not going to hesitate to point out the inaccuracies and weaknesses of the candidates I do not agree with.  Again, this doesn’t mean I can’t tone it down and be civil.  But I am not going to be quiet so a candidate I do not agree with can get out of the primaries “unscathed” to take on Healey.

      • 😛

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        That said I agree with Sco, Andy, et al. The past few days here have not been helpful anyone. Honestly I was thinking of leaving, but it seem yesterday we started to turn the corner back to the good olde BMG. Lets keep it that way. Civil discussion of ideas, not personal attacks.

        • Although whining about it doesn’t help, I would like to continue to point out this backroom crap is why the Democrats lose every single time and why scads of people have left the Democratic roles in favor of Unenrolled. I know so many people personally turned off by this stuff. I know people – regular first-time delegates – who were disguested once again after Worcester.

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          It has to be brought to the party over and over again that they are killing themselves. They have to at some point stop blaming the nonexistant Republicans and realize it’s their own damn fault.

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          That said, I spent this week attacking the work to be done with renewed vigor. I got up, VOLUNTARILY, at 5:15am so I could go the the Lowell train station and hand out brochures for Deval. If that doesn’t say “I’ve gotten over it and I’m working hard” I don’t know what does.

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          I don’t get up before 8:30am for just anyone, you know!

          • and yes it drives me crazy, but I think I have gotten to the point now where I expect it. Is that a good thing? Probably not, but it does keep my bp down a bit.

  5. but it doesn’t address those who seek to marginalize Deval Patrick supporters by, among other things, referring to them as “Kool-aid drinkers.” 

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    I think this matter was already calming down on it’s own.  I don’t see any reason why the hornet’s nest needed to be smacked again. 

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    • …and our hosts will get us there if they have to drag us kicking and screaming 🙂
      In actuality, I think one of the many and myriad components of (non-utopic) leadership is knowing how much noise to let fly under the radar …
      But hey, they run this thing. I’m not going to call the shots based on my view from the peanut gallery.

      • … a Democrat in the corner office in January ’07. 🙂

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        Really Will, I think I’m just stating the obvious. Indulging in SPEAKING OUT and RIGHTEOUS INDIGNATION is a political Twinky: feels good for a while, but doesn’t satisfy. It doesn’t move the ball forward. You don’t get what you want. You just piss off neutral people.

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        The only way to convince people and get votes is to respect their dignity — and to have some oneself.

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        Here’s a good example.

        • Do you know why you get a 6 Charley?  Because you created the greatest phrase EVER!  POLITICAL TWINKIE!!  It works so well.  Oh yeah, the substantive stuff of your post was good too.

          • Twinkies HAVE no substance!

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            (Referring to the fact you had to alternately compliment Charley on the substance on top of the phrase)

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            (Oh nevermind, I’m probably the only one to think that was funny)

            • but I didn’t want to be the only geek to point it out.  😉  I love ya Lynne!

        • who is almost entirely lost with that one?

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          In one breath, you say that speaking out and righteous indignation is basically pointless.

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          On the other hand, you link to a site about Gandhi (whose brilliance was not his passivity but knowing his enemy) and talk about dignity.

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          Please do clarify.

          • I plead guilty to getting lofty, here. Nobody here is starving, no one’s going without salt, and no one here is Gandhi. But the letter to Lord Irwin is a classic example of how talk to someone with whom you disagree — and how powerful that is. Gandhi got results. If any progressive campaign wants to get people on board, it takes a degree of self-control on the adherents’ part. You can’t just get mad at everyone who’s “stupider” than you are.

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            Compassion, in its own way, wins. Getting angry at the world loses.

        • Remember, the LITERAL meaning of Utopia is No Place.  A mythical pretense.

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          So, if a Dem in the corner is Utopia, why THAT means….

          • I had always thought the u in Utopia was rooted in eu, meaning good, instead of ou, meaning not, but Merriam-Webster’s agrees with you.  I’m still holding out for a pun in Greek, but today I learned something.

            • Getting a little far off-topic, but my understanding has alway been that Sir Thomas More (who first coined the word “utopia”) did in fact intend it as something of a pun, so it really means both things at the same time.

          • You gave me a 4? Ouchers!
            I wasn’t gonna rate yours!
            How about a suggestion for our ever-evolving rating policy: If you are personally involved in a thread, err on the side of letting others rate the other participants’ comments. Especially if you are the poster as well. (This latter point has already been suggested)
            A rational is, if you disagree with someone, they may, hopefully, listen; but if you disagree with them and then reach out and tweak their nose, they probably won’t listen.

  6. Why are passing tea towels when we should be singing Kumbyah.  I mean the love is just dripping in here.  On a more serious note I will say this is why it can be adventageous when people meet.  It is a lot easier for me to really dislike Susan now that I have met her!  SHE IS PERSONABLE DAMNIT!  Sorry I just can’t be serious.  I mean now that I have met Charley and David and put a person to the ID I have a lot harder time being mean.  Too much anonymity (I don’t want to open that can  of words oup again) is the problems of the net (and of course I don’t mean disclosing one’s name because you all know I am Andy but you have no clue who I really am or how dashing I am!).  Just my two cents.

  7. This speaks to the timing of the Mass primary: A September primary doesn’t leave much time to heal wounds and mend fences. A June primary makes much more sense. And a June primary would give the winner more time to raise money for the general.

  8. Perhaps we could have “Political Twinkie du Jour?” Whenever a candidate comes up with some damn silliness that is the verbal equivalent of a golden yellow spongecake stuffed with sugary, fat laden creme and a shelf life of 25 days…they get the “Twinkie du Jour” award. 

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    Okay, and you can’t nominate George Bush every day.  That would just be wrong.  The man comes to work every day, bless his little heart, armed with a peashooter and you guys show up with noo-cular weapons. That boy’s just not right.

  9. FOOD FIGHT! 

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    Of course, a little twinkie guts never hurt anyone.  All in good fun. 

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