Remember a little while back when the national press woke up to something we’ve known for a long time — that Mitt Romney’s ancestors practiced polygamy — and lots of folks wondered aloud how long it would take before other candidates’ ancestors’ … bad habits, I guess you could say … hit the papers?
Well, you can all stop holding your breath. A new study has concluded that ancestors of John Edwards, John McCain, and — surprise! — Barack Obama were all slaveholders. Important caveat: the study is styled a “first draft,” and its findings haven’t been confirmed by anyone else.
Big whoop.
Please share widely!
To an excellent discussion of this subject on Wikipedia. The move version is reviewed at IMDB.
John Edwards and John McCain owe reparations. And Obama owes reparations to himself.
As far I know, Obama is not a descendant of slaves. His dad was Kenyan. That’s one reason why African-Americans have been slow to warm to him; his ancestors did not share their common heritage.
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That said, I think this whole whose-ancestors-killed-the-most-puppies thing is interesting from a historical perspective, but utterly irrelevant to any of the candidates’ qualifications for the Presidency.
Perhaps it was his MUM’S family that were slave owners!
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Besides, a person of status in ancient Kenya may well have owned a few slaves from rival tribes!
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Oooohhhh….have we checking into the PUPPY KILLING heritage of the Romney’s?
syphax didn’t suggest that Obama doesn’t “owe” reparations (white mom), just that he isn’t “owed” reparations (black dad apparently doesn’t have enslaved heritage).
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But yes, this is all quite silly.
you’ll see that yes, in fact, it is Obama’s mother’s family who has been traced to slaveholders.
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Syphax’s point, however, is that Obama wouldn’t be eligible to receive reparations because he is, as far as we know, not descended from slaves.
The argument goes that as a black man in America he would be entitled to them because he suffered under the racist system thats been in place since slave days. White people whose family got here after slave days, like my own, would also be required to pay because we have benefited from the racist system in place. Personally I think its a load, but thats the argument for reparations.
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It should also be pointed out that Obama grew up in Hawai’i, where there is a huge racial mix (and no dominant ethnic group) and the only racial tension is the animus some native Hawai’ians feel towards the hoales, or white people. He attended one of the state’s best schools, which was mentioned by Elvis in Blue Hawai’i as being one of the most beautiful places on the island. Its not like he grew up in tenement on the south side of Chicago. Now hes a US Senator and a top tier presidential candidate. He seems to have done alright for himself. I don’t think he needs the reperation.
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No, that is one kind of reparation. It’s not the only kind. In fact, about 10 years ago I was at a lecture given by Dr. John Hope Franklin, who talked about the Tulsa race riots of 1921. This was a situation where the city police and US military certainly didn’t protect, and in many cases assisted with the riot that burned down a very middle class black neighborhood and business region. When he talked about reparations, he talked about things like the city and state making a conscious “over” investment in one or more black neighborhoods in Tulsa today, in schools and parks for example.
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Everybody would pay via taxes. No individual would personally receive money or goods from the government. The neighborhood would improve considerably.
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That’s another kind of reparation. There’s many more ideas out there too.
reparations to those people who lost homes or businesses due to the willful inaction (or participation) of government officials, though I wonder how many are left from 1921. Similarly, I supported reparations to the people who lost their homes and businesses when we rounded up people of Japanese descent during WWII.
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To make reparations like the one you discuss here would benefit people who may or may not have been affected by the riot. Its a solution that doesn’t fix the problem.
…why should a taxpayer in Massachusetts now be required to pay taxes for reparations for actions that were taken or not taken in Oklahoma in 1921?
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Regarding the portion of your comment
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This was a situation where the city police and US military certainly didn’t protect…
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I’ll merely point out the fact that the Posse Comitatus acts dating from the 1870s generally prohibit the use of the US military in internal police keeping. Was well they should.
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http://en.wikipedia….
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It would not be beyond the realm of possibility that, if the US military were to be actually use for policing, that they would eventually turn into an American equivalent to the Nazi SS. Yes, it can happen here.
It is both possible that Obama’s Kenyan ancestors were slaves and/or sold their rivals to slave traders operating in East Africa. Kenya was not at all immune from the slave trade. Perhaps westerners don’t know this because the main slavers in East Africa were Arabs, and E. African slaves were primarily used in Asia and the Middle East, not America. Europeans did slave in East Africa, but came realtively late to the scene. A common response I got to asking Kenyan’s what they think of Black AMericans & their plight is “I guess they were too stupid to avoid capture.” This may be a genuine sentiment, or a way of deflecting anger or shame at the fact that some of their own ancestors were victims or agents of the slave trade.
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So, it is a shakey assumption that Obama’s dad’s family wasn;t touched by slavery because he is from Kenya is.
….fudamentally incapable of not participating in off topic tangents, but since this whole thread is off topic by nature I won’t check into rehab just yet.
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So…
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There is no shakey assumption that Obama’s fathers family wasn’t touched by slavery in any way simply because he is from Kenya. There is a pretty good assumption that since his father is a native Kenyan that his direct ancestors were not owned by white American as part of the American slave trade, therefore, he would not be entitled to any reparations (which don’t exist anyway).
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Laurel’s analysis is absolutely correct.
n/t
(and glad to hear it), but others do. I see it as just another example of the blindness of some Americans to the rest of the world. If it didn’t happen here, it aint important and certainly isnt pertinent?
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Regarding off topic stuff, well, my comment added supporting information to a diary topic that is really, really stupid. Maybe we both need an intervention. đŸ™‚
….think there’s a 12 step group yet?
Signs are that African-Americans are more politically savvy than you suggest.
My guess is that it’s really mainly the civil rights Old Guard that is slow to warm to Obama, perhaps because he rose to prominence without [having to] pay homage to them. Line-jumping whippersnapper!
Maybe it’s just that they don’t know him so well.
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Would it be unfair to say, though, that on some issues you yourself are a bit of a Homage Collector? I don’t mean by that, of course, that you are requiring anyone to say “Laurel’s the greatest!” or “We want more Latin signatures!” Rather, you have certain issues you want to see full agreement on.
…it’s probably because Obama realizes that, to come to national prominance, he needs to reach out for support from people outside the A-A community. So he isn’t necessarily going to swear fealty to the pharisees of the Black civil rights establishment.
it is the nature of power structures, or rather the people making up power structures, to be jelous of their power. perhaps “homage” was not the best word for me to have used, but if obama is operating outside of some power structure(s) that feel deflated, sidestepped or whatever by him, they may have retaliated by defaming him. your theory that they are defaming him because his set of issues isn;t perfectly equal to theirs is also possible. our theories aren;t mutually exclusive. there is probably no single explanation.
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and no, it would not be fair to say that i am an homage collector, because the subject of the thread is not me and i am not putting myself in the sphere of public scrutiny by running for office.
i mistakenly attributed a theory to you, kbush, that you didn’t express. but anyway, yes, it could also be because the powers that be don’t know him well. it could be all those things.
I was arguing a bit ad hominem (or ad mulierem if you prefer.) I just wanted to point out that we don’t have to think that this is a power-centered move. We all have certain tests, ideological, stylistic, issue-based, etc.
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I’m also working on developing a partisan reluctance for us to attribute cynical motives to our allies — certainly not without compelling evidence.
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Also it’s KBusch not KBush. That extra special letter is even more important to me now!
I take your point about not wanting to attribute cynical motives to allies, but if you wait for compelling evidence before postulating any motives, you’ll have little to contribute to the discussion. How often do we get real-time compelling evidence for the reason behind any political moves? FWIW, I’m glad you threw your kinder, gentler hypothesis on the stack. Now we sit back and wait 30 years for everyone’s memoirs to reveal the truth of the situation.
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Yes, we all have ideaological tests, but what that discussion has to do with this sub-thread about Obama I still haven’t a clue. I also don’t understand your aparent fixation with my tag line. Yup, it’s in Latin. I didn’t author it; it came that way. I found it, it fit, I use it.
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I am a font of typos and frequently misspell. My flub of your name was unfortunate – sorry about that.
They are quite eager, have lots of funds, have a lot of spare time, and enjoy exposing cynical motives in Democrats. Let me assure you, though, they don’t do it to their own.
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So listen to them when they bring up evidence, but if we are going to advance progressive causes, we have to develop a severe aversion to the circular firing squad.
So, everybody in the top six are covered now except….Clinton and Guiliani.
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WHAT are they hiding? >:~)
At least we try to make a case for that on http://mormonsagains…
Aside from the absurdity of holding one responsible for the acts of distant ancestors, you are opening a line of inquiry that may do your own side more harm than good.