Things would be better if we made sure there were enough resources, and if we made sure that what we know about how the brain works – and a person’s development stages – caught up with actual practices and teachings in foster parent situations.
<
p>(sorry, this gets into a long, personal story.)
<
p>It’s tough to keep families like that together, that’s for sure. I lost a great friend who was in the foster program for half her life because she and her foster parent, after years of doing extremely well together, started to feud and couldn’t make amends… with my friend eventually moving half way across the country when she turned just 19 or 20, practically on a whim.
<
p>The saddest thing is she was in a very good, stable environment with a foster parent who not only loved her, but truly thought of her as her ‘daughter in heart.’ I really think that my friend, despite all the love and support she got, in part subconsciously sabotaged the relationship when the going got a little tough (the classic rebellious stage where teens push for independence – and parents adjust to giving it), making her fears of abandonment come true. Neither my friend nor her foster parent were quite equipped to handle it, all the while my friend was past 18 and the state had long since declared her “Mission Accomplished” without so much as a second thought.
<
p>Luckily, it seems she’s as though she’s doing very well, despite the fact that it pains me to even describe her current situation in such a mundane way, as if I barely know her (“it seems as though” – ugh). I suppose, though, after all these years, I don’t know her well at all, so it’s accurate. (She left when I was around 17 or 18.)
<
p>In life, we all have friendships and relationships that end prematurely – people see each other less and less over time because of uncontrollable circumstances such as going abroad, college, new friends, etc. However, this loss particularly hurt, because I’ve always felt that it could have been saved had just a few things happened differently – had state systems given more support, had she had more counciling, had her foster parent had more training to deal with things when they got a little tougher, etc. Not to mention, we were two peas in a pod.
<
p>However, that’s definitely a glass half empty view, because in many ways she is a success, given the circumstances. She overcame the developmental gaps that I now understand she had at the time. She’s managed to figure out how to have stable living arrangements; she’s actually been married now for around a year, living with the same person for much longer.
<
p>That said, despite the fact that in some ways the system worked for her, I almost feel that it was in spite of everything. She found the right foster parent at the right time, after a series of very bad ones (one of whom wouldn’t allow her to pour herself a drink without asking permission in her mid teens!). However, how many people are that lucky? She only found her foster parent through a friend, after having known the person for months before the two people came together. And that person, who was asked if she was interested, accepted. How often does that happen? Clearly, a lot of other glasses in Massachusetts aren’t even half full, but completely empty.
<
p>It is frustrating to know these things – the things I lived through – are happening every day. It’s frustrating to know that, in all honesty, things actually worked out better here than in many situations – after all, at least she had those years of stability and lessons that served as a foundation so she didn’t have to learn too much on her own.
<
p>All across the country, we desperately need to reform the foster system, making sure we’re addressing the needs of children every step of the way, while also not abandoning people as soon as they turn 18 or even 21. Many of these kids were abused for years, barely being cared for at best. How anyone could expect these kids to recover from that abuse quickly or without sufficient resources, especially given the fact that we do know this trauma can cause real and enduring physical and mental stumbling blocks. It’s a long term project that, for some, may seemingly go on forever – but it can and must be done.
frankskeffingtonsays
Given that a few of the factiods about kids who age out of foster care:
<
p>25% of aged out foster youth experience homelessness.
40% are on public assistance.
60% of females have given birth.
AmberPaw, you’re right, this is a pretty intense post. And this foster father deserves a lot of credit.
<
p>I do have comment, based on the bit in this post about the abnormal results of the brain scan (I assume the author means to say that in some sense the child is not responsible for his actions because his brain scan showed an abnormality related to his abuse–I don’t know whether you agree with this) and based on your earlier post on Senator Marzilli. It seems to me that you are very comfortable pointing to external forces that, in your view, should relieve people of criminal responsibility for their actions. I think everyone will agree that there are some cases in which this is so–someone points a gun to the defendant’s head and forces him to commit a crime; the defendant is psychotic and strangles his spouse believing she is a monster; or what have you. But it seems to me that the author of this post takes this idea too far. Of course the boy’s brain scan revealed abnormalities–he was raised in an abnormal environment. Our minds are embodied in our brains. I don’t really see the difference between saying “his history of abuse caused him to have a brain abnormality that allowed him or compelled him to commit a crime” and “his history of abuse caused him to have a bad character, which allowed him or compelled him to commit a crime.” I do not think that we are absolved of responsibility for our acts just because science has advanced to the point where we can analyze the biological causes of our acts rather than just the external environmental causes of our acts. I would be curious to have your thoughts on this–I think your perspective would be interesting, given what you do for a living.
In life, it doesn’t boil down to either put in jail or on the streets. In the cases where someone has some sort of mental or physical problem causing them to commit crimes, they don’t belong in jail – that’s not where they’ll be treated. However, they don’t belong on the streets, either. There are many things in between. Obviously, people who are a danger to either themselves or others can’t be loosed on society, but putting them in prison isn’t helping them get better, places strains on the criminal justice system and doesn’t help society. It’s a lose, lose, lose, a waste of resources and insurance that perhaps people who could be rehabilitated won’t be. (Heck, maybe it has something to do with why so many people who go to jail end up going back. In the end, this could be an important way to save money and make the streets safer.)
<
p>I think sometimes people equate the ‘insanity defense’ (not that his kid was insane, but he was mentally disabled in some ways) as a get-out-of-jail-free card… it’s really not… and that’s an important distinction.
amberpawsays
…what the Kos poster was getting at is that early abuse and exposure to violence changes the brain. There is now substantial research being done to validate that concern: http://teacher.scholastic.com/…
<
p>Further, to try to hijack this thread with the kind of bogus “straw man” [construct you set up, claim I said when I did not say it, then you attack the phony “straw man” set up – three lumps of coal for you, friend]. I have never stated that, if a trier of fact with all the evidence properly adjudicated Marzilli guilty after trial this would somehow be wrong; however, as of today that event has not occurred AND ‘better late than not at all’ Marzilli IS out of circulation and IS getting some kind of medical care – for what? You and I don’t know…
<
p>However: THIS thread is NOT about Marzilli. It IS about the problems with the current foster care scheme here and in other states, the lack of mental health services for foster teens, the lack of respite for foster families, and the need for more supports for foster care providers. The heroic efforts made by foster care providers to provide love and homes to kids who have a longer road to adulthood due to early abuse deserves support and discussion here.
<
p>Shame on you TedF for trying to hijack this thread with a phoney-baloney straw man made up of things I have never said.
What do you think? Do you have questions as a result? What questions?
<
p>Amber, you solicited comments and questions. I’m interested in the relationship between illness and responsibility and how we draw the line–and how medical technology (e.g., brain scans) affects how we draw the line. I was struck by the foster father’s apparent view that the child’s illness was relevant to his responsibility for his crime, and I recalled the similarities to the Marzilli discussion. (By the way, I could care less about Marzilli–I know little of his politics and I have no opinion as to the truth of the charges against him. Was it the mention of his name that got you so worked up?) I thought you’d have an interesting view on this topic, which has real implications for public policy. I guess I won’t be hearing it?
<
p>TedF
frankskeffingtonsays
So what is the answer? We can second guess the author and suggest that the day his foster son started carrying around an 8 inch knife because he was influenced by a Rambo movie, is the day a big warning light should have gone off and he wouldn’t have walked into a school with it. (And is anyone going to tell me that there is no connection between media images and teen behavior?)
<
p>No, I’m not going to second guess the author at all. But I want to point out how flawed the system is and how late we react to emerging social problems–like a near pyschopath scaring the shit out of a mother and daughter by bursting into their home with a rifle. With behavior like that, there will be plenty of forces that will push for a criminal justice solution and at that point, they may be right.
<
p>But the warning signs for him were early–juvenile probation; the knife in school, the family history. So simple to predict, but we as a society has not been able to respond. Clearly as Ryan points out it will cost far less in tragedy, money and effort than the road we presently travel.
ryepower12 says
Things would be better if we made sure there were enough resources, and if we made sure that what we know about how the brain works – and a person’s development stages – caught up with actual practices and teachings in foster parent situations.
<
p>(sorry, this gets into a long, personal story.)
<
p>It’s tough to keep families like that together, that’s for sure. I lost a great friend who was in the foster program for half her life because she and her foster parent, after years of doing extremely well together, started to feud and couldn’t make amends… with my friend eventually moving half way across the country when she turned just 19 or 20, practically on a whim.
<
p>The saddest thing is she was in a very good, stable environment with a foster parent who not only loved her, but truly thought of her as her ‘daughter in heart.’ I really think that my friend, despite all the love and support she got, in part subconsciously sabotaged the relationship when the going got a little tough (the classic rebellious stage where teens push for independence – and parents adjust to giving it), making her fears of abandonment come true. Neither my friend nor her foster parent were quite equipped to handle it, all the while my friend was past 18 and the state had long since declared her “Mission Accomplished” without so much as a second thought.
<
p>Luckily, it seems she’s as though she’s doing very well, despite the fact that it pains me to even describe her current situation in such a mundane way, as if I barely know her (“it seems as though” – ugh). I suppose, though, after all these years, I don’t know her well at all, so it’s accurate. (She left when I was around 17 or 18.)
<
p>In life, we all have friendships and relationships that end prematurely – people see each other less and less over time because of uncontrollable circumstances such as going abroad, college, new friends, etc. However, this loss particularly hurt, because I’ve always felt that it could have been saved had just a few things happened differently – had state systems given more support, had she had more counciling, had her foster parent had more training to deal with things when they got a little tougher, etc. Not to mention, we were two peas in a pod.
<
p>However, that’s definitely a glass half empty view, because in many ways she is a success, given the circumstances. She overcame the developmental gaps that I now understand she had at the time. She’s managed to figure out how to have stable living arrangements; she’s actually been married now for around a year, living with the same person for much longer.
<
p>That said, despite the fact that in some ways the system worked for her, I almost feel that it was in spite of everything. She found the right foster parent at the right time, after a series of very bad ones (one of whom wouldn’t allow her to pour herself a drink without asking permission in her mid teens!). However, how many people are that lucky? She only found her foster parent through a friend, after having known the person for months before the two people came together. And that person, who was asked if she was interested, accepted. How often does that happen? Clearly, a lot of other glasses in Massachusetts aren’t even half full, but completely empty.
<
p>It is frustrating to know these things – the things I lived through – are happening every day. It’s frustrating to know that, in all honesty, things actually worked out better here than in many situations – after all, at least she had those years of stability and lessons that served as a foundation so she didn’t have to learn too much on her own.
<
p>All across the country, we desperately need to reform the foster system, making sure we’re addressing the needs of children every step of the way, while also not abandoning people as soon as they turn 18 or even 21. Many of these kids were abused for years, barely being cared for at best. How anyone could expect these kids to recover from that abuse quickly or without sufficient resources, especially given the fact that we do know this trauma can cause real and enduring physical and mental stumbling blocks. It’s a long term project that, for some, may seemingly go on forever – but it can and must be done.
frankskeffington says
Given that a few of the factiods about kids who age out of foster care:
<
p>25% of aged out foster youth experience homelessness.
40% are on public assistance.
60% of females have given birth.
tedf says
AmberPaw, you’re right, this is a pretty intense post. And this foster father deserves a lot of credit.
<
p>I do have comment, based on the bit in this post about the abnormal results of the brain scan (I assume the author means to say that in some sense the child is not responsible for his actions because his brain scan showed an abnormality related to his abuse–I don’t know whether you agree with this) and based on your earlier post on Senator Marzilli. It seems to me that you are very comfortable pointing to external forces that, in your view, should relieve people of criminal responsibility for their actions. I think everyone will agree that there are some cases in which this is so–someone points a gun to the defendant’s head and forces him to commit a crime; the defendant is psychotic and strangles his spouse believing she is a monster; or what have you. But it seems to me that the author of this post takes this idea too far. Of course the boy’s brain scan revealed abnormalities–he was raised in an abnormal environment. Our minds are embodied in our brains. I don’t really see the difference between saying “his history of abuse caused him to have a brain abnormality that allowed him or compelled him to commit a crime” and “his history of abuse caused him to have a bad character, which allowed him or compelled him to commit a crime.” I do not think that we are absolved of responsibility for our acts just because science has advanced to the point where we can analyze the biological causes of our acts rather than just the external environmental causes of our acts. I would be curious to have your thoughts on this–I think your perspective would be interesting, given what you do for a living.
<
p>Thanks for bringing this post to our attention.
<
p>TedF
ryepower12 says
In life, it doesn’t boil down to either put in jail or on the streets. In the cases where someone has some sort of mental or physical problem causing them to commit crimes, they don’t belong in jail – that’s not where they’ll be treated. However, they don’t belong on the streets, either. There are many things in between. Obviously, people who are a danger to either themselves or others can’t be loosed on society, but putting them in prison isn’t helping them get better, places strains on the criminal justice system and doesn’t help society. It’s a lose, lose, lose, a waste of resources and insurance that perhaps people who could be rehabilitated won’t be. (Heck, maybe it has something to do with why so many people who go to jail end up going back. In the end, this could be an important way to save money and make the streets safer.)
<
p>I think sometimes people equate the ‘insanity defense’ (not that his kid was insane, but he was mentally disabled in some ways) as a get-out-of-jail-free card… it’s really not… and that’s an important distinction.
amberpaw says
…what the Kos poster was getting at is that early abuse and exposure to violence changes the brain. There is now substantial research being done to validate that concern: http://teacher.scholastic.com/…
<
p>Further, to try to hijack this thread with the kind of bogus “straw man” [construct you set up, claim I said when I did not say it, then you attack the phony “straw man” set up – three lumps of coal for you, friend]. I have never stated that, if a trier of fact with all the evidence properly adjudicated Marzilli guilty after trial this would somehow be wrong; however, as of today that event has not occurred AND ‘better late than not at all’ Marzilli IS out of circulation and IS getting some kind of medical care – for what? You and I don’t know…
<
p>However: THIS thread is NOT about Marzilli. It IS about the problems with the current foster care scheme here and in other states, the lack of mental health services for foster teens, the lack of respite for foster families, and the need for more supports for foster care providers. The heroic efforts made by foster care providers to provide love and homes to kids who have a longer road to adulthood due to early abuse deserves support and discussion here.
<
p>Shame on you TedF for trying to hijack this thread with a phoney-baloney straw man made up of things I have never said.
tedf says
<
p>Amber, you solicited comments and questions. I’m interested in the relationship between illness and responsibility and how we draw the line–and how medical technology (e.g., brain scans) affects how we draw the line. I was struck by the foster father’s apparent view that the child’s illness was relevant to his responsibility for his crime, and I recalled the similarities to the Marzilli discussion. (By the way, I could care less about Marzilli–I know little of his politics and I have no opinion as to the truth of the charges against him. Was it the mention of his name that got you so worked up?) I thought you’d have an interesting view on this topic, which has real implications for public policy. I guess I won’t be hearing it?
<
p>TedF
frankskeffington says
So what is the answer? We can second guess the author and suggest that the day his foster son started carrying around an 8 inch knife because he was influenced by a Rambo movie, is the day a big warning light should have gone off and he wouldn’t have walked into a school with it. (And is anyone going to tell me that there is no connection between media images and teen behavior?)
<
p>No, I’m not going to second guess the author at all. But I want to point out how flawed the system is and how late we react to emerging social problems–like a near pyschopath scaring the shit out of a mother and daughter by bursting into their home with a rifle. With behavior like that, there will be plenty of forces that will push for a criminal justice solution and at that point, they may be right.
<
p>But the warning signs for him were early–juvenile probation; the knife in school, the family history. So simple to predict, but we as a society has not been able to respond. Clearly as Ryan points out it will cost far less in tragedy, money and effort than the road we presently travel.