Both Sanders and Biden made excellent and reassuring closing statements.
Sanders’ statement was a simply beautiful summation of his life’s deep commitment to equality.
Biden’s statement was a reassuring and refreshingly adult, practical commitment to marshalling American resources to defeat coronavirus and unite the country, and it was clear he knew how to use the levers of government to do it.
Please share widely!
Yep. This is a nice civil coda to an often bitter primary. All of Sanders attacks were issue based and the same kind of attacks Trump will use in the general and Biden responded pretty well to most of them. He will need better answers on trade and security, but he now has a good idea of what Trump will throw at him on those questions. This debate made me proud to have twice voted in a primary for Bernie Sanders and eager to vote in the general for Joe Biden.
I saw just one President on tonight’s stage.
I share the reaction of a commentator on CNN regarding Mr. Biden’s commitment to choose a woman as a running mate — after Bernie Sanders and his supporters have spent so much time bashing everyone else for equivocating on M4A, it was telling that he equivocated on the question of whether he will match Mr. Biden’s commitment.
That equivocation is all you need in order to understand why women — and especially African American women — are supporting Joe Biden.
I don’t think anything should be guaranteed about a running mate. The only pertinent question is whether s/he passes the “Long Live the President” test.
I’m not following — are you saying that we shouldn’t take Mr. Biden’s public commitment seriously?
I’m saying he should not make that kind of commitment.
Biden’s commitment to choose a woman Vice President is EXACTLY the right decision a wise leader makes to build the liberal Big Tent coalition to unite the Democratic party, defeat Trump and govern in the midst of an incompetence pandemic.
I think it was a smart commitment. It was the headline coming out of that debate. It’s a great contrast to Trump and it helps let every woman disappointed that nevertheless in 2020 the glass ceiling persisted know that there is a silver lining this cycle. A young, competent, progressive woman who will be the most consequential Vice President chosen since Harry Truman will be placed on the ticket.
I suspect that he’s already had discussions with at least one potential nominee. Based on his interview last week with Lawrence O’Donnell, where he said that debate experience was a “very important” factor, I agree that the short-list is Elizabeth Warren, Kamala Harris, and Amy Klobuchar.
If I had to guess today, it would be Ms. Klobachar. I’m not sure I like that choice, but I think that’s where he’s likely to be going.
Not to be too crass, but I’m guessing that his strategists are thinking that Mr. Biden already has the AfAm vote and Ms. Klobuchar can deliver the “suburban women” vote (including those who voted for Mr. Trump in 2016″.
I think the most important question at the moment is how much damage happens to America between now and January of 2021. I really don’t think we can afford to leave the current administration in power that long. We are watching a huge swath of small businesses be destroyed, especially in the hospitality industry.
ALL patriots who want to unify our country and the world around shared democratic and human rights principles will have a seat at Joe Biden’s table whose founding members include blue-collar workers, women and the AA community. There will be room for ALL.
I thought one of the raps on Biden was that he is not the excitement candidate. IMO Klobuchar is the least exciting of the three you mentioned.
Oh, I think Ms. Klobuchar is among the least exciting of the possible choices. That’s actually why I suspect she’s most likely.
FWIW, here is one list of possibilities.
That’s a solid list. I met and campaigned for Tammy Duckworth in her first unsuccessful race for Congress and have been impressed with her ever since. She’s my dark horse along with Senator Cortez-Masto and Gov. Grisham. The latter of whom has confessional experience and past experience running a statewide health dept.
I think it’s likelier it’s a 2020 rival, with Harris or Klobuchar being the likelier over Warren. I agree Klobuchar would be a somewhat disappointing choice for VP.
@Klobuchar would be a somewhat disappointing choice for VP:
Only among progressives like you and me.
I think Ms. Klobuchar is an ideal “wedge” candidate to split off votes of traditional Republicans who don’t support Donald Trump or the Trumpists.
No, I think this choice would be disappointing among more than that. The calculus, such as it is, isn’t about splitting votes or wedges between us and them. It’s about wedges between us and us.
The very first question in the first presser after the announcement of the VP pick will be: “Gov/Sen/Mrs , you’re playing second fiddle to a man with allegations of misconduct and inappropriate conduct, how does that make you feel?”
People forget that Biden began this race with his own personal, DIY and, ahem, hands-on, #metoo moment. That, I think, is the main impetus behind the pledge to choose a female nominee: and for that reason I think the choices are even fewer in number: either Elizabeth Warren who is seen as a progressive feminist who won’t put up with that kind of stuff–but I think she’ll refuse–or Kirsten Gillibrand, who’s hand wielded the razor that (metaphorically) cut Al Frankens throat. In the absence of Warren, Gillibrand solidifies Bidens flank, considerably more than Klobuchar.
Klobuchar would be a spectaculer FU to the progressive wing of the party.
The message would be, “We don’t need you, and we sure as heck aren’t going to govern with you.”
That is typically a post-election message.
The progressive wing shouldn’t need to have its hand held.
Is that a political calculation or are you just being holier than thou?
It’s not about hand holding, it is about respect. More than that, even.
Hand holding is “don’t be mean to us on twitter.” This would be on the order of, “You have no place in this party.”
OK, Boomer.
@It’s not about hand holding, it is about respect. More than that, even.:
@Is that a political calculation or are you just being holier than thou?:
It is indeed a cynical political calculation, and has nothing to do with respect or handholding.
Suburban women turn out in droves in each election. Earnest young progressives do not.
If the first and only priority is somehow removing Donald Trump and the Trumpists from power, than it makes MUCH more sense to secure the votes of suburban women — especially midwestern suburban women — who dislike the current administration and who vote in every election than to pander to foot-stamping from people who aren’t likely to show up and vote for Joe Biden whatever he does.
It’s classic triage. Joe Biden will get some votes whatever he does. Some voters will not turn out to vote for him whatever he does. He’s paying attention to the voters in the middle — voters whose behavior is likely to change based on this choice
It appears to me that there are many more suburban women — especially midwestern suburban women — who voted for Donald Trump in 2016 and now regret that vote than progressives who will show up with one VP choice and not show up if Ms. Klobuchar is the pick.
Ms. Klobuchar delivered the primary votes of MN Democrats to Joe Biden. What other potential pick has done anything comparable?
This choice is not about respect, handholding, or being holier than thou. It is about priorities and electoral reality.
It would be a short term win he does not need in exchange for real intraparty strife down the road.
The win we all need is in November of 2020. That’s the only win in the cards for any American, and it’s the only win that matters right now.
Sadly we need more than just beating Trump in November.
The implication of Tom’s remark is that Klobachar would somehow boost Biden’s chances. This is taking the “electability” thing way past self parody.
@This is taking the “electability” thing way past self parody:
Whether you like it or not, it appears to be the truth.
The only thing we need beyond beating Trump in November is retaking the Senate and keeping the House. I include all of that when I talk about winning in November. NOTHING ELSE MATTERS.
There is no “parody” about who did and did not vote already and who does and who does not vote.
The “movement” that Mr. Sanders has been attempting to mobilize has not shown up to vote. They didn’t show up in 2016, they didn’t show up in the primaries of 2020, and there is no data to suggest that they will show up in November of 2020.
Those suburban women (and other moderates) that Ms. Klobuchar appeals to DO show up — just like AfAm voters that Mr. Biden appeals to.
I don’t like that data any more than you. I think Ms. Warren would have made a FAR better President than Mr. Biden. That doesn’t change the facts.
I appreciate that link. It’s pretty much in line with the others I’ve been seeing.
The reason I think Ms. Klobuchar is the most likely pick is that Mr. Biden is already in good shape with AfAm votes and I think he’s counting on growing support from Latino voters once Mr. Sanders steps aside.
By picking a young, white and conservative woman from Minnesota as VP, he implicitly appeals to white Republican women across the country, and especially in the midwest.
I think the essence of Mr. Biden’s strategy is to turn out AfAm and Latino voters, turn out the rest of the traditional Democratic base, and skim off the votes of moderate Republicans who cannot stomach any more of Donald Trump and the Trumpists.
I think it’s a winning strategy. I think whatever disaffected “Bernie or Bust” support he loses will be more than offset by his strength among AfAm and Republican women voters.
Sadly I think his failure to break through, even in progressive states that are friendly to his message, gives lie to the myth that his supporters are a wide chunk of the electorate. Most are like me. Happy to see him run and vote for him and ready to fall in line behind Biden. Even more so with this calamity befalling then nation.
Not quite happy, here, considering the likely consequences, but resigned.
@resigned:
I agree with you — “resigned” describes me to a T.
I can’t say I am terribly surprised, though I did entertain the thought that Warren could pull it off.
I would have been very surprised if Sanders had remained competitive, once we saw Biden’s Super Tu comeback.. Mene, mene, tekel, upharsin.
Not All Women. Hell, not all Black women, either.
It’s fascinating to me, the degree to which the two wings of the party seem completely unable to hear or understand each other on this one. When I’m evaluating candidates, I’m looking at what they propose to do in office; if I’ve chosen a presidential candidate, I want them to pick the VP who seems most likely to successfully continue those policies and priorities if they have to assume the presidency. What their nomination and election would mean in terms of representation for women, non-white people, GLBTQ people, is very much secondary: a great thing if it comes with also being the best successor on policy, but not the point.
I realize that for many in the other wing of the party, this representation feels so important that it apparently overrides considerations of whether the candidate is who you’d want in office if you were evaluating them from behind a screen, as it were, and had only issues and proposals to go on. But I don’t get it, on a gut level, and thus to me, an actual woman, Biden’s commitment to name a woman as his running mate is arguably a good political move, but not at all presidential. I don’t even understand why it makes you feel like you were seeing a President in him.
I assume you’re as mystified by my reaction as I am by yours, and at this point I’m not sure there’s any way to reach true mutual understanding across the gulf. But I do think it’s perhaps worth all of us bearing in mind that it’s there: a real and fundamental difference in how we see the world and what our priorities are.
Of course I don’t mean ALL women. Surely you are as able to read demographic and polling statistics as me. When I said I saw a President, I wasn’t referring to just that announcement. I was instead referring to the entire evening.
So far as I’m concerned, if your priorities are anything other than removing Donald Trump and the Trumpists from power in November, than those priorities are misplaced. I don’t think our gender, gender preference, age, marital status, income status, education level, career path, or anything else matters.
African American voters — and in particular, African American women — have firmly and unmistakably rejected your candidate. They’ve heard him. They’ve heard his speeches. In some cases, they’ve met him. They’ve said “Thanks, but no thanks”. Perhaps not ALL of them, but in at least two digit majorities.
Mr. Sanders campaigned hard in Minnesota. Mr. Biden did not campaign at all there. The exit polls from Minnesota are similarly clear. Minnesota women chose Mr. Biden, who did not even campaign, over Mr. Sanders 41 to 25 percent.
Black voters in Minnesota were, overall, less enthusiastic about Mr. Biden than whites — the margins were 42 to 27 among whites, versus 47 to 43 among blacks. Nevertheless, Mr. Biden won both groups after not even campaigning.
Mr. Sanders did well among urban Minnesota voters, winning that group by 34 to 33 percent (although it is worth noting that Ms. Warren received 19% of that group). Suburban Minnesota voters chose Mr. Biden by a margin of 44 to 30%, and rural voters chose Mr. Biden by 47 to 22%.
Mr. Biden got the support of only 31% of Minnesota voters who describe themselves as “Liberal”. Mr. Sanders got 38%, Ms. Warren got 21% of that group. Mr. Biden, on the other hand, got 60 percent of the “moderate” voters. No Minnesota respondents described themselves as “conservative”.
Defeating Donald Trump and Trumpists is our ONLY imperative. I think that every choice we make should be overwhelmingly influenced by that imperative. I think Elizabeth Warren would have been a FAR better President than Joe Biden will ever be. Millions of AfAm voters disagree with me.
If Mr. Sanders had, in fact, caused massive numbers of voters under 30 to turn out for him, then we would have a more difficult choice. That didn’t happen.
We MUST deal with the world we face, not the world we want to face. I don’t see how any other priority can compete with that.
The one big problem is that neither will be President for another 10 months and we need their solutions now! I suppose Sanders can at least introduce his ideas in the Senate immediately, but given how that place is run these days I would not be optimistic.
The incompetence pandemic began long before the outbreak of COVID-19.
Touche!
My brother texted “right!” to text wishing Biden was President right now. What a whirlwind two weeks it’s been.