that the GOP is obviously giving itself a hernia to attempt to appear “diverse” by first headlining a woman, then two men of color. i’m just counting the moments until they roll out their house gay. if they can find a self-loathing lesbian latina, they’ll have all the bases covered in their big tent. (shhh! they don’t want you to know that the tent is labeled “exceptions to our rule”. think anyone notices? shhhh! / wink wink /).
although i wore out our LP of the musical growing up, i only saw the movie once, as a kid. i had no recollection of how cornily acted the rolls played by the extras were, lol! how goofy. i suppose at the time it was meant to infuse the scene with “ethnic color” or something, but now it has a bit of the feel of the bug-eyed Vaudevillian in blackface. oh well. i still love the music and probably still know every line of the lyrics. and the ultimate message that i received in that first and only viewing, that tradition isn’t always positive and can in fact be uncomfortably constraining, well lets just say i’m glad that’s what made an impression on me rather than the silly acting in the background. maybe it resonated with me because, growing up a girl and then a lesbian woman, i experience that truism first-hand.
christophersays
I’m never going to get this verbatim, but there’s a scene from All In the Family where Archie Bunker is looking at a ballot and says something like, “There’s a Negro, a Jew, and Irishman, and Italian, and a regular American – that’s what I call a balanced ticket!”
O’Grady, Goldberg, Giovanni, Johnson?… You got a Mick, a Hebe, a Wop, and an ordinary American!… That’s what I’d call a balanced ticket!
johndsays
Many of these cable shows do benefit from the viewership of the shows before and after their shows. Maddow picked up a sweet time slot but still is getting trounced by FOX. But at least she is only a few slots below Nancy Grace. At first I thought the list was arranged alphabetically but then I did see it was in order of popularity. The Obama presidency may create more Maddow viewers… or if there is a backlash, FOX might go even higher.
<
p>This info from http://tvbythenumbers.com/cate… is only the last month but it seems consistent with other weeks. If anyone has more accurate numbers please update me.
<
p>January 26 – February 20, 2009
<
p>NETWORK PROGRAM NAME P2+ A25- A18- A18- A35-
54 34 49 64
FOX THE OREILLY FACTOR 3,608 803 169 591 1,438
FOX HANNITY 2,768 671 141 491 1,101
FOX GLENN BECK 2,173 512 130 411 894
FOX SPECIAL RPT BRET BAIER 2,063 455 103 341 876
FOX THE FOX REPORT S.SMITH 2,056 492 105 377 904
FOX ON THE RECORD GRETA 2,020 462 102 337 794
CNN LARRY KING LIVE 1,500 407 95 339 622
FOX AMERICAS NEWSROOM 1,500 366 75 264 681
FOX YOUR WORLD CAVUTO 1,476 313 73 246 578
FOX THE OREILLY FACTOR(RPT) 1,451 458 111 345 709 MSN COUNTDOWN OLBERMAN 1,359 446 176 371 687
CNN ANDERSON COOPER 1,351 440 117 375 608
FOX STUDIO B W/S.SMITH 1,274 278 55 213 507 HLN NANCY GRACE 1,252 469 118 378 691
FOX HAPPENING NOW 1,242 301 60 218 526 MSN RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 1,223 383 143 342 606
FOX LIVE DESK, THE 1,218 290 53 213 507
CNN SITUATION ROOM 1,089 266 86 234 476
FOX FOX AND FRIENDS 1,066 351 44 251 623
CNN CAMPBELL BROWN 1,052 310 83 274 466
CNN LOU DOBBS TONIGHT 994 288 83 253 474
MSN COUNTDOWN OLBERMANN(RPT) 825 285 134 276 414
CNN ANDERSON COOPER 824 335 91 292 430
CNN CNN NEWSROOM 809 227 68 194 365
MSN HARDBALL MATTHEWS 740 212 71 167 352
christophersays
…I could have sworn I heard that Olberman had begun to beat O’Reilly in the ratings.
johndsays
This chart shows O’Reilly is pummeling Olbermann but is gets very close in the coveted 24-54 age group.
lightirissays
Rational people aren’t as anxious or frenzied to hear their views validated on TV as they once were. Why? Because their guy got elected and is doing what the electorate hired him to do. The conservative crackpottery, however, are now so far off the reservation that they are seeking validation of their views, thus they will tune in in large numbers to hear their views validated.
<
p>It’s like a seesaw. I’ve no doubt the Limbaugh cranks will watch O’Reilly and his ilk religiously while the rest of us relax a little and turn the TV off.
johndsays
I have wondered where the support for FOX comes from. When the Republicans were in power in Washington, FOX was doing fantastic. The last time MSNBC beat FNC in primetime was the week of July 30, 2001 (other than a week last summer when Laura Ingram sat in for O’Reilly).
<
p>So it seems FOX does well when the Republicans are in power and are doing very well when Democrats are in power. I guess us “conservative crackpottery” must need validation no matter who is in charge. No seesaw from us nutbag wingnut crackpots.
<
p>On a more honest note… I am a fairly consistent FOX channel watcher (no surprise). However, recently I have stopped watching Hannity purely due to the loss of Alan Colmes. I know many here thought he was a light weight compared to Sean Hannity, but he did give “balance” to the fair and balanced show. Without that balance or an “opposing” view, I’m watching Lou Dobbs. MSNBC offers no opposing views on any of their nightly shows, just rants from Olbermann, Maddow and Matthews (Moe, Larry and Curly). I also have to admit that I have switched from watching Fox and Friends to Sqwuak Box and/or Morning Joe.
laurelsays
that not everybody loves maddow. certainly the followers of those she so royally skewers won’t find her at all savory.
<
p>do you like her john?
johndsays
clearly has preconceived notions on every subject. She also “rarely” if ever has any strong opposition on her show. The closest she gets is the occasional tuft with Pat Buchanan and she usually gets her ass kicked. Plus that goofy grin is annoying.
p>she gets more than pat buchanan and, unlike anyone on fox news, actually lets the opposition speak without speaking over them or shutting them off.
johndsays
lightirissays
She is so closed minded and clearly has preconceived notions on every subject.
<
p>The death of irony. Again.
kbuschsays
busy, Ms. Maddow clearly seems to have time to read things and have informed opinions.
<
p>If I understand the comment to which I have linked, it’s okay to be persistent (or close-minded) and have beliefs (or preconceived notions) provided you’re busy enough so that you lack the time to be open-minded and informed.
<
p>The descriptors in parentheses (close-minded, preconceived) apply to liberals; the synonymous descriptors outside the parentheses (persistence, beliefs) apply to conservatives who are here to keep us honest.
<
p>I’m sure, lightiris, that, like me, you need all the help you can get to remain honest. Will you join me in expressing gratitude for this service JohnD provides us? He’s very busy and he barely has time for it.
lightirissays
Like Jon Stewart is fond of saying, this stuff just writes itself.
her show’s only been on for a few months. usually it takes years for someone to get the sort of audience Rachel already has.
<
p>Moreover, where it counts, the age groups that sell ads, Rachel (and Keith) do exceptionally well and often beat Faux News.
johndsays
I blind monkey would get good ratings.
<
p>I presented some numbers of where she is getting beat every single night against FOX. Other than your “feelings” do you have numbers to support your argument. I will admit to be wrong if you show me the data.
<
p>What will these yo-yos being doing once they stop beating up George Bush? Criticize President Obama… Heaven forbid!
her numbers in the 24-55 range, which is essential for luring in advertisers, runs even with Fox and on many nights she bests them. Ditto Keith.
johndsays
or is it just a “feeling”. The actual data I displayed above is data, no a feeling. I’ve asked you twice now to back up what you are saying. Do you have proof to contradict the data below?
<
p>NETWORK PROGRAM NAME P2+ A25- A18- A18- A 35-
54 34 49 64
FOX THE OREILLY FACTOR 3,608 803 169 591 1,438
FOX HANNITY 2,768 671 141 491 1,101
MSN COUNTDOWN OLBERMAN 1,359 446 176 371 687
MSN RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 1,223 383 143 342 606
This info from http://tvbythenumbers.com/cate… is only the last month but it seems consistent with other weeks. If anyone has more accurate numbers please update me.
And your caveat is spot on. Good work. When I have more time I’ll see what I can crunch. The numbers comparing Feb 09 to Feb 08 don’t look encouraging for Fox, certainly, but an accurate understanding of the implications of the data would require a decent trend analysis.
johndsays
kbuschsays
Fox has consistently had better ratings than the other news outlets. And non-Fox networks have not done so well trying to out-Fox Fox with their own conservatives.
<
p>If I’m not mistaken, Maddow’s numbers look at lot better than her predecessor’s on MSNBC and Olbermann’s look better than his. If we understand the game that way, then Maddow doesn’t look bad at all.
<
p>There are some places that will draw more liberals, and other places that will attract more conservatives.
… will die off because of mortality. Also the advertising revenue from such an audience will be worth less because their buying power is getting killed by the fact that their retirement incomes have been decimated.
johndsays
O’Reilly is beating Olbermann in all age groups except 18-34 so it might be sometime before us old guys are dead or O’Reilly will die before his audience does. Plus, some folks have told me the 24-54 age group is what advertisers want and he beats Olbermann (803,000 to 446,000).
johndsays
It should be interesting o see how these shows change over the next 4 years with our changing economy and political direction.
sue-kennedysays
Won the ratings war, lost the election.
johndsays
johndsays
O’Reilly still trashing Olbermann in the ratings and…
that the GOP is obviously giving itself a hernia to attempt to appear “diverse” by first headlining a woman, then two men of color. i’m just counting the moments until they roll out their house gay. if they can find a self-loathing lesbian latina, they’ll have all the bases covered in their big tent. (shhh! they don’t want you to know that the tent is labeled “exceptions to our rule”. think anyone notices? shhhh! / wink wink /).
Remember this oldie but goodie?
<
p>
<
p>:-D
With apologies to Tevya papas…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v…
although i wore out our LP of the musical growing up, i only saw the movie once, as a kid. i had no recollection of how cornily acted the rolls played by the extras were, lol! how goofy. i suppose at the time it was meant to infuse the scene with “ethnic color” or something, but now it has a bit of the feel of the bug-eyed Vaudevillian in blackface. oh well. i still love the music and probably still know every line of the lyrics. and the ultimate message that i received in that first and only viewing, that tradition isn’t always positive and can in fact be uncomfortably constraining, well lets just say i’m glad that’s what made an impression on me rather than the silly acting in the background. maybe it resonated with me because, growing up a girl and then a lesbian woman, i experience that truism first-hand.
I’m never going to get this verbatim, but there’s a scene from All In the Family where Archie Bunker is looking at a ballot and says something like, “There’s a Negro, a Jew, and Irishman, and Italian, and a regular American – that’s what I call a balanced ticket!”
Can’t find the video, but found the quote (I think):
<
p>
Many of these cable shows do benefit from the viewership of the shows before and after their shows. Maddow picked up a sweet time slot but still is getting trounced by FOX. But at least she is only a few slots below Nancy Grace. At first I thought the list was arranged alphabetically but then I did see it was in order of popularity. The Obama presidency may create more Maddow viewers… or if there is a backlash, FOX might go even higher.
<
p>This info from http://tvbythenumbers.com/cate… is only the last month but it seems consistent with other weeks. If anyone has more accurate numbers please update me.
<
p>January 26 – February 20, 2009
<
p>NETWORK PROGRAM NAME P2+ A25- A18- A18- A35-
54 34 49 64
FOX THE OREILLY FACTOR 3,608 803 169 591 1,438
FOX HANNITY 2,768 671 141 491 1,101
FOX GLENN BECK 2,173 512 130 411 894
FOX SPECIAL RPT BRET BAIER 2,063 455 103 341 876
FOX THE FOX REPORT S.SMITH 2,056 492 105 377 904
FOX ON THE RECORD GRETA 2,020 462 102 337 794
CNN LARRY KING LIVE 1,500 407 95 339 622
FOX AMERICAS NEWSROOM 1,500 366 75 264 681
FOX YOUR WORLD CAVUTO 1,476 313 73 246 578
FOX THE OREILLY FACTOR(RPT) 1,451 458 111 345 709
MSN COUNTDOWN OLBERMAN 1,359 446 176 371 687
CNN ANDERSON COOPER 1,351 440 117 375 608
FOX STUDIO B W/S.SMITH 1,274 278 55 213 507
HLN NANCY GRACE 1,252 469 118 378 691
FOX HAPPENING NOW 1,242 301 60 218 526
MSN RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 1,223 383 143 342 606
FOX LIVE DESK, THE 1,218 290 53 213 507
CNN SITUATION ROOM 1,089 266 86 234 476
FOX FOX AND FRIENDS 1,066 351 44 251 623
CNN CAMPBELL BROWN 1,052 310 83 274 466
CNN LOU DOBBS TONIGHT 994 288 83 253 474
MSN COUNTDOWN OLBERMANN(RPT) 825 285 134 276 414
CNN ANDERSON COOPER 824 335 91 292 430
CNN CNN NEWSROOM 809 227 68 194 365
MSN HARDBALL MATTHEWS 740 212 71 167 352
…I could have sworn I heard that Olberman had begun to beat O’Reilly in the ratings.
This chart shows O’Reilly is pummeling Olbermann but is gets very close in the coveted 24-54 age group.
Rational people aren’t as anxious or frenzied to hear their views validated on TV as they once were. Why? Because their guy got elected and is doing what the electorate hired him to do. The conservative crackpottery, however, are now so far off the reservation that they are seeking validation of their views, thus they will tune in in large numbers to hear their views validated.
<
p>It’s like a seesaw. I’ve no doubt the Limbaugh cranks will watch O’Reilly and his ilk religiously while the rest of us relax a little and turn the TV off.
I have wondered where the support for FOX comes from. When the Republicans were in power in Washington, FOX was doing fantastic. The last time MSNBC beat FNC in primetime was the week of July 30, 2001 (other than a week last summer when Laura Ingram sat in for O’Reilly).
<
p>So it seems FOX does well when the Republicans are in power and are doing very well when Democrats are in power. I guess us “conservative crackpottery” must need validation no matter who is in charge. No seesaw from us nutbag wingnut crackpots.
<
p>On a more honest note… I am a fairly consistent FOX channel watcher (no surprise). However, recently I have stopped watching Hannity purely due to the loss of Alan Colmes. I know many here thought he was a light weight compared to Sean Hannity, but he did give “balance” to the fair and balanced show. Without that balance or an “opposing” view, I’m watching Lou Dobbs. MSNBC offers no opposing views on any of their nightly shows, just rants from Olbermann, Maddow and Matthews (Moe, Larry and Curly). I also have to admit that I have switched from watching Fox and Friends to Sqwuak Box and/or Morning Joe.
that not everybody loves maddow. certainly the followers of those she so royally skewers won’t find her at all savory.
<
p>do you like her john?
clearly has preconceived notions on every subject. She also “rarely” if ever has any strong opposition on her show. The closest she gets is the occasional tuft with Pat Buchanan and she usually gets her ass kicked. Plus that goofy grin is annoying.
get back to me when you’ve seen it more often…
<
p>she gets more than pat buchanan and, unlike anyone on fox news, actually lets the opposition speak without speaking over them or shutting them off.
<
p>The death of irony. Again.
busy, Ms. Maddow clearly seems to have time to read things and have informed opinions.
<
p>If I understand the comment to which I have linked, it’s okay to be persistent (or close-minded) and have beliefs (or preconceived notions) provided you’re busy enough so that you lack the time to be open-minded and informed.
<
p>The descriptors in parentheses (close-minded, preconceived) apply to liberals; the synonymous descriptors outside the parentheses (persistence, beliefs) apply to conservatives who are here to keep us honest.
<
p>I’m sure, lightiris, that, like me, you need all the help you can get to remain honest. Will you join me in expressing gratitude for this service JohnD provides us? He’s very busy and he barely has time for it.
Like Jon Stewart is fond of saying, this stuff just writes itself.
her show’s only been on for a few months. usually it takes years for someone to get the sort of audience Rachel already has.
<
p>Moreover, where it counts, the age groups that sell ads, Rachel (and Keith) do exceptionally well and often beat Faux News.
I blind monkey would get good ratings.
<
p>I presented some numbers of where she is getting beat every single night against FOX. Other than your “feelings” do you have numbers to support your argument. I will admit to be wrong if you show me the data.
<
p>What will these yo-yos being doing once they stop beating up George Bush? Criticize President Obama… Heaven forbid!
her numbers in the 24-55 range, which is essential for luring in advertisers, runs even with Fox and on many nights she bests them. Ditto Keith.
or is it just a “feeling”. The actual data I displayed above is data, no a feeling. I’ve asked you twice now to back up what you are saying. Do you have proof to contradict the data below?
<
p>NETWORK PROGRAM NAME P2+ A25- A18- A18- A 35-
54 34 49 64
FOX THE OREILLY FACTOR 3,608 803 169 591 1,438
FOX HANNITY 2,768 671 141 491 1,101
MSN COUNTDOWN OLBERMAN 1,359 446 176 371 687
MSN RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 1,223 383 143 342 606
Gotta add a link if you want people to evaluate data.
The link was above, as well as the data. I copied the pertinent data only. Here’s the link
…but still don’t have the data you cite. Where on the site is the data you put in your comment?
… the February numbers overall?
<
p>http://tvbythenumbers.com/2009…
This info from http://tvbythenumbers.com/cate… is only the last month but it seems consistent with other weeks. If anyone has more accurate numbers please update me.
<
p>January 26 – February 20, 2009
And your caveat is spot on. Good work. When I have more time I’ll see what I can crunch. The numbers comparing Feb 09 to Feb 08 don’t look encouraging for Fox, certainly, but an accurate understanding of the implications of the data would require a decent trend analysis.
Fox has consistently had better ratings than the other news outlets. And non-Fox networks have not done so well trying to out-Fox Fox with their own conservatives.
<
p>If I’m not mistaken, Maddow’s numbers look at lot better than her predecessor’s on MSNBC and Olbermann’s look better than his. If we understand the game that way, then Maddow doesn’t look bad at all.
<
p>There are some places that will draw more liberals, and other places that will attract more conservatives.
<
p>That should be unsurprising.
… will die off because of mortality. Also the advertising revenue from such an audience will be worth less because their buying power is getting killed by the fact that their retirement incomes have been decimated.
O’Reilly is beating Olbermann in all age groups except 18-34 so it might be sometime before us old guys are dead or O’Reilly will die before his audience does. Plus, some folks have told me the 24-54 age group is what advertisers want and he beats Olbermann (803,000 to 446,000).
It should be interesting o see how these shows change over the next 4 years with our changing economy and political direction.
Won the ratings war, lost the election.
O’Reilly still trashing Olbermann in the ratings and…
<
p>Glen Beck show continues to kick ass as well.